Drunks Force Downtown Winnipeg Business to Close

DowntownBIZ wrote:. And its almost everyone that smokes, not just the down and out.

I asume that you mean that almost all smokers dispose of their biohazardous waste in an unsanitary matter, and NOT that almost everyone is a smoker. While littering is one issue, I was making the point that the percentage of smokers among criminals, bums, drunks is about 100%, whereas among the rest of the population it is lower than 20%. So if we had a strict non-smoking policy for places like parks, benches, bus shelters etc it would have a much larger impact on the "problem population" than on people conducting regular business in downtown, and may even encourage the odd regular smoker to curb the habit. Those who only come to downtown to cause trouble would be more inclined to stay away.

Based upon what DowntownBIZ is saying it sounds like they are doing a great job. Let's at least acknowledge that.

What everyone is saying is we need more. Everyone, including the Downtown BIZ folks, agree. But they are only one change advocate. The city and the province and some of the bleeding heart agencies need to invest much more.

We have to ask why the indigent are so attracted to the downtown? Can we start changing that? Do we need more facilities for these people? Will that even help? Should we move skid row somewhere else? (J/K, sorta'). Lot's of questions. Not many answers.

But the DowntownBIZ folks aren't the peeps we should be looking to for those answers. The fact they are involved is encouraging.

"We have to ask why the indigent are so attracted to the downtown? "

Here is a few solutions we have been advocating for:

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/fyi/downtown-blueprint-87559892.html

DowntownBIZ wrote:

.......... This takes time, and planning and everyone working together.

Isn't 30 or 40 years enough time to get this shet fixed???

DowntownBIZ wrote:"

[url=http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/fyi/downtown-blueprint-87559892.html

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/fyi/downtown-blueprint-87559892.html[/quote[/url] [/quote]

What a complete crock!!

Doesn't Grande know that we've done what he's suggesting whith the effect that we now have slums scattered throughout the city causing shet.

Do you ever have a positive thought

Did you just pull your head out to take a breathe?

Look at the facts and not some fcuken spin that all these professional "revitalizers" are giving us.

The downtown has been a shithole for 30 years. It still is and more money is not the answer!

JTF wrote:

DowntownBIZ wrote:"

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/fyi/downtown-blueprint-87559892.html[/quote

What a complete crock!!

Doesn't Grande know that we've done what he's suggesting whith the effect that we now have slums scattered throughout the city causing shet.

Just out of curiosity, what are your thoughts into improving downtown and Winnipeg social issues in general? Not trying to cause trouble; just asking

Ever hear of the broken window syndrome?

Arrest people for spitting on the street....for flicking a cigarette but on the ground...for anything that's causing a problem....all the little things....zero tolerance.

But first we'd have to build some jails....or perhaps ship people off to their home reserves.

You may know where I'm going with this....directing some attention to the Indian Elephant in the room.



Check out what happened in New York City when this was done.

http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&safe=off&q=broken+window+effect&aq=6&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+wind&gs_rfai=&fp=3ca66db58134ebc6

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/columnists/the-real-reasons-portage-is-scary-99681249.html

We can thank the city for that. In its bizarre version of city planning, city council decided that it would be a good idea to improve Main Street -- which had become Winnipeg's equivalent of Skid Row -- by moving its problems to Portage Avenue, which was even then the rose -- somewhat faded -- of Winnipeg.

Is there an echo in here?

You know what? I was gonna mention NYC and how they have taken major steps in cleaning up that city to make it much safer and clean for both tourists and citizens alike. I'm not sure exactly what they did, but to my understanding, it has been very successful. I didn't mention it because I was think that some people might come out screaming "DON'T COMPARE US TO OTHER CITIES. WE ARE NOT OTHER CITIES. WE ARE WINNIPEG blah blah blah". This is what happens to me often when I suggest we look at other successful cities as to how to run and lead Winnipeg.
Seriously though, if it can work in a city of 10 million people, it can work in Winnipeg. It's just that in Winnipeg, there is too much of a fear to upset the indians because the indians are the root cause of this problem. It's like you can't say anything to them that they might consider offesive or racist. That is a HUGE problem facing Winnipeg; the extreme political correctness towards aboriginals. Bottom line is that far too many of them are ruining large areas of the city, especially the downtown. And yes, I'm going to say because yes, it's true. So, once the province and city grow some balls and stand up to this problem, the problem areas in Winnipeg will continue to grow and prosper because people are too afraid to confront them. And they will keep coming and coming into Winnipeg from off the reserves. So if something isn't done now, I dare say that this problem may grow too big and too expensive for anyone to handle, and the city for the most part will become one large slum reserve like you see around the Praire provinces.

How's this one?

If you come to Winnipeg and don't have a job or income....move along!! No welfare for you!!

You are absolutely correct in your assertion that all this shet will become a racial issue.

Somebody has finally to grow some balls and confront the realities of what we are facing.

JTF wrote:How's this one?

If you come to Winnipeg and don't have a job or income....move along!! No welfare for you!!

I like the cut of your jib jab, J!
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Manitoba is fast becoming a welfare province. I have two aunts that work in the welfare department, and I would be more than willing to guide anyone who doubts what I have to say, to have those two tell you how bad the Manitoba government is enabling those able bodies individuals, mostly aboriginal, who just don't want to work and are content to just sucking off the tit of the provincial gov't. It's bad, and it's getting worse. Welfare recipients know how easy it is to get social assistance in Manitoba, which is why many come from across the country to settle in Manitoba simply for the ease of the money. This needs to change fast; this needs to change quick; this needs to change soon.

exactly

Perhaps, in retrospect, the City should NOT have given over their welfare arrangements to the Province. Now we cannot control it.

^^^

Good point, JTF.

Is anyone surprised welfare is a lifestyle under an NDP government? I believe we've been sayin' welfare is an issue here for some time.

As for natives arriving here, that should also not be a surprise: it is much easier to hide in Winnipeg than anywhere else in Manitoba. And while they hide here they can easily collect welfare and other aid whilst sitting on their collective arses.

Who will you vote for in the next election?

JTF wrote:

DowntownBIZ wrote:"

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/fyi/downtown-blueprint-87559892.html[/quote

What a complete crock!!

Doesn't Grande know that we've done what he's suggesting whith the effect that we now have slums scattered throughout the city causing shet.

You've an eloquent way of expressing yourself.

Anyhoo, I was not aware the city has created multiple skid rows throughout the city. I see much of what was contained to Main Street has moved to Portage avenue.

What would you recommend JTF?

JTF wrote:Ever hear of the broken window syndrome?

Arrest people for spitting on the street....for flicking a cigarette but on the ground...for anything that's causing a problem....all the little things....zero tolerance.

But first we'd have to build some jails....or perhaps ship people off to their home reserves.

You may know where I'm going with this....directing some attention to the Indian Elephant in the room.



Check out what happened in New York City when this was done.

http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&safe=off&q=broken+window+effect&aq=6&aqi=g10&aql=&oq=broken+wind&gs_rfai=&fp=3ca66db58134ebc6

So, applying this to a specific situation in Winnipeg.

In the past few years (say ~5) there have been Indians who have sat on the ground near the Graham entrance to The Bay.

The reason why they might feel comfortable doing this is because The Bay hasn't kept its property clean enough. The doors need to be repainted or re-whatever to make them look new again. Maybe the sidewalk should be made to look squeeky clean.

That way the Indians won't feel comfortable there, and they'll move on.

Funny how the management of The Bay doesn't do anything to shooo 'em away, they're perhaps too scared of legal action re: "human rights".

grumpy old man wrote:Is anyone surprised welfare is a lifestyle under an NDP government? I believe we've been sayin' welfare is an issue here for some time.

Ha!

It was the PC government of Gary Filmon in the 90s that forced the City to give up its welfare program and let the Province administer it.

Whole lotta good that did.

In effect, it doesn't matter the colour stripe of the Provincial or Federal or what have you is.. Policy is dictated by the big bankster Illuminati. And until that changes, nothing will.

Do we really need a Provincial level of government?

I think a City region should be able to look after its own affairs and not be a slave to the Province.

It's good that some of us can talk about the "largest, real issue" facing downtown (and Winnipeg in general) without fear of being called racist. The more we talk about it, the more people will listen and hopefully start to talk about this subject without fear of being labelled racist, because they are not. They only speak the truth. Maybe if enough people speak loudly and forcefully on this matter, then perhaps political leaders will take notice and will deal with these natives. Enough is enough already. But if no one says anything, political leaders will do nothing, as usual, and the aboriginal problem in Winnipeg will grow.
In your honest opinion, does anyone think things will ever change with regards to indians in Winnipeg? Will we ever be able to deal with the aboriginal problem the city faces?

jimj_wpg wrote:It was the PC government of Gary Filmon in the 90s that forced the City to give up its welfare program and let the Province administer it.

Whole lotta good that did.

I read recently where peeps were counting NDP wags' 1999 comments. It seems not a press conference goes by without a reference to 1999.

The PC government polices sure have staying power. heh heh

So tell me, what has that to do with the price of tea in China? You an NDP wag jimj_wpg?

AGEsAces wrote:I
If the government REALLY was concerned for the welfare of these people, they would round them all up...ship them off to a remote treatment centre and detox them. Give them psychological or medical treatment, and train them to do some actual work. Then find them some kind of job, holding them each accountable for their actions.

But can you teach an old Brown or Grizzly Bear-person new things?





Yes, ship the ones who don't want (or can't) change their behaviour ... back to their ... um ... habitat.

Isn't that what we'd do to Bears if they were in the City causing mischief? The ones at Assiniboine Park having been tamed?

From Wikipedia:

The brown bear is primarily nocturnal. In the summer, it gains up to
180 kilograms (400 lb) of fat, on which it relies to make it through winter, when
it becomes very lethargic. Although they are not full hibernators,
and can be woken easily, both sexes like to den
in a protected spot such as a cave, crevice,
or hollow log during the winter months. Brown bears are mostly
solitary, although they may gather in large numbers at major food
sources and form social hierarchies based on age and size.^[25]
Adult male bears are particularly aggressive and are avoided by
adolescent and subadult males. Female bears with cubs rival adult males
in aggression and more intolerant of other bears than single females.
Young adolescent males tend to be least aggressive and have been
observed making non-agonistic interactions with each other. In his Great
Bear Almanac, Gary Brown lists 11 different sounds bears produce in
9 different contexts. Sounds expressing anger or aggravation include
growls, roars, woofs, champs and smacks while sounds expressing
nervousness or pain include woofs, grunts and bawls. Sows will bleat or
hum when communicating with their cubs.

"Bears like to den in a protected spot, like a cave..."

Or a Winnipeg Transit bus shelter! LOL.

"now all downtown bus shelters are washed and deodorized every second day ("

LOL, yeah even when its below freezing and you make ice!


heh.. only hurt for a little while

More money is needed to throw at the poor people!
Why hasn't anyone ever asked for more money??

Because Rosen, money is the root of all evil, and sometimes/most of the time, can't solve any "social ills".

The bus stop I am talking about is the one in front of CityPlace on Graham. The thing I find interesting is that the majority of the buses that come from the more 'well off' suburbs ( River Heights, St.Vital, Linden Woods, Whyte Ridge, etc) all stop either at Portage and Fort or Main and Pioneer. Yet the route that goes to Ft. Richmond / St. Norbert stops way over at cityplace ( along with north main, Talbot, EK, and transcona buses). Why is that? Not that I car really, but it is kind of a PITA when I have to leave work 10 min earlier than my co-workers, because my bus stop is 4 blocks away and all their bus stops are right on the corner.

Strange.