NHL Rumours... The NHL is returning to Winnipeg

grumpy old man wrote:

Outsider wrote:Its fine to shoot me down.
But please show me what positive things have happened in Winnipeg in the last 15 years which would demonstrate a team can be competitive now when it could not 15 years ago. What companies have started up in the Winnipeg region who have hired a large block of employees? And I am not talking about jobs which pay < $12 an hour.
We have a new 15,000 seat arena. But we had a 15,000 seat arena and I am not positive but it may have even had more seats than the new one. Sure we have a lot more concerts. But are the concert buying crowd the same as the hockey crowd?

I would love to be convinced.

You are very quick to dismiss the impact of the new arena grasshopper.

Tell me, where did the old Winnipeg Arena stand in North America business-wise? Yet this new arena is amoungst the busiest in all of North America, and the world for that matter. Coincidence?

How about the population of Winnipeg in 1996 compared to today? Last year alone it grew almost 12,000? In 1996 Winnipeg CMA was 683,500. It was just published that the city was approaching 750,000.

How about the Canadian dollar almost at par with the US dollar? http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/48/CAD_USD_Exchange_Rates.png

How about the unemployment rate in Winnipeg and Manitoba being the lowest or second lowest in Canada for 2 or 3 years now. Maybe longer. http://cuer.sauder.ubc.ca/cma/data/Employment/UnemploymentRate/rate-unempl-winnipeg.pdf

In 2009 the city added almost 10,000 jobs. http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/lfss04h-eng.htm

How about instead of looking at the glass half empty we start looking at the glass half full. Christ we are such incredible negatrons...

Speaking about glass half full/half empty.
You get that way after you hear enough B.S.

And speaking of stats.
http://www.fin.gc.ca/fedprov/eqp-eng.asp

And I could not see the average salary per hour from :
http://www40.statcan.ca/l01/cst01/lfss04h-eng.htm

Outsider wrote:Speaking about glass half full/half empty.
You get that way after you hear enough B.S.

Too true..

Getting hotter:

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/s...29/daily2.html

url not found

I was just going to post that! Great read, things are looking promising.
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2010/03/29/daily2.html

Bartron wrote:I was just going to post that! Great read, things are looking promising.
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2010/03/29/daily2.html

Seems they are used to losing, may as well lose some more if they move here.

eViL tRoLl wrote:

Bartron wrote:I was just going to post that! Great read, things are looking promising.
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2010/03/29/daily2.html

Seems they are used to losing, may as well lose some more if they move here.

Pardon me?

Losing? As in money or games?

Great attitude...

eViL tRoLl wrote:

Bartron wrote:I was just going to post that! Great read, things are looking promising.
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2010/03/29/daily2.html

Seems they are used to losing, may as well lose some more if they move here.

If you can PROVE to me that an NHL team will lose money here, I'll start to consider thinking about taking you seriously.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/video/latest/Bring-back-the-Jets
Of course, there is more emphasis on Southern Ontario than Winnipeg, but what else have we come to expect in this country?

This is what's in today's FP...GGF


http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/NHL-has-spoken-with-True-North-about-return-to-Winnipeg-89436782.html

Edwin remeber the Jets ,, losed mucho money .

EdWin wrote:

eViL tRoLl wrote:

Bartron wrote:I was just going to post that! Great read, things are looking promising.
http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2010/03/29/daily2.html

Seems they are used to losing, may as well lose some more if they move here.

If you can PROVE to me that an NHL team will lose money here, I'll start to consider thinking about taking you seriously.

Perhaps you can PROVE TO US how a NHL team can make money in a city where:
1. The largest employer in the whole province is the government
2. The government missed their budget projections by about 600 Million in the wrong direction last year.
3. This same government is budgeting millions in losses for the next 3 or 4 years.
4. This same government depends on the largess of its neighboring provinces to provide basic services. I was told Manitoba gets about a quarter of its revenue from Equalization.
5. The Canadian dollar is near par with the American dollar. And a Canadian Dollar at par with American is bad for Canadian jobs. It appears a par dollar is bad for non-manufacturing also since Convergys is closing its call center. And this call center once employed 2,200 people in Manitoba.

Haven't we gone through this with you once already Outsider Chicken Little? Like very recently? Go read a fricking newspaper. Learn a little about how the Manitoba economy is actually performing (despite the ndp) for Christ's sake.

Why is every one of your posts about the world ending? Time to take your doom and gloom elsewhere. We're all full up here...

If you like, I can change your handle to Chicken Little...

According to a statement made on CJOB this morning...

1) The NHL IS looking for an opportunity to bring a team back to Winnipeg.
2) It will NOT be the Coyotes if they can prevent it by finding a buyer who will keep the team in Glendale (Phoenix).

I wonder why they are fighting so hard to keep a team in that market. I could see it if it was on the cusp of profitability, but it has lost so much money and continues to lose it hand over fist.

grumpy old man wrote:Haven't we gone through this with you once already Outsider Chicken Little? Like very recently? Go read a fricking newspaper. Learn a little about how the Manitoba economy is actually performing (despite the ndp) for Christ's sake.

Why is every one of your posts about the world ending? Time to take your doom and gloom elsewhere. We're all full up here...

If you like, I can change your handle to Chicken Little...

So you resort to name calling when you do not have a valid argument.
Kind of sad. I was hoping you were a different than some other forums where they only want to hear from people who "agree with the party line".
Oh well live and learn.

Oh BULLSH1TE. Whaa whaa whaa.

We discussed this with you only days ago and rebutted everyone of your negative posts. Is your memory that short or do you only care to regurgitate your same old tired negative crap? That is your MO after all eh? Then whinge when people call you on it.

Grow up and debate like a adult or go back to the darkside where your kind are more tolerated.

Outsider wrote:

Perhaps you can PROVE TO US how a NHL team can make money in a city where:
1. The largest employer in the whole province is the government

Not relevant. Who employs an individual doesn't determine how they spend their money

Outsider wrote:2. The government missed their budget projections by about 600 Million in the wrong direction last year.

Not Relevant. Unless they are getting some sort of government subsidy that would not be spent on the Moose/Arena otherwise.

Outsider wrote:3. This same government is budgeting millions in losses for the next 3 or 4 years.

See 2

Outsider wrote:4. This same government depends on the largess of its neighboring provinces to provide basic services. I was told Manitoba gets about a quarter of its revenue from Equalization.

See #2. And I think it's closer to 40%

Outsider wrote:5. The Canadian dollar is near par with the American dollar. And a Canadian Dollar at par with American is bad for Canadian jobs. It appears a par dollar is bad for non-manufacturing also since Convergys is closing its call center. And this call center once employed 2,200 people in Manitoba.

Okay, you may have a point here. But it is a double edged sword. par dollar is bad for mfg ( that's the general consensus - I say it provides stimulus for businesses to be more competitive and make them even more profitable when Cdn dollar drops). So there may be less corporate disposable income from the Mfg. sector. However, the mfg sector doesn't drive the economy in this prov. Look at the names on the luxury boxes in the MTS centre. It's not New Flyer, Standard, MCI. It's Great West, Investors, Pitblado.
But on the other hand most contracts are made in US$, so when cdn dollar goes up, then the team pays less on salaries.

So what you have shown is that there may be issues with them not making money if the Mb. Gov't buys the team.

Do I think they'll make money if they move here - probably not much if any. Probably more likley they'll lose a little bit. But I don;t think it will be because of any of the reasons you mentioned.

grumpy old man wrote:I wonder why they are fighting so hard to keep a team in that market. I could see it if it was on the cusp of profitability, but it has lost so much money and continues to lose it hand over fist.

Might be embarrassment?
Think of the tons of cash that's been poured down the toilet since that franchise was moved. Probably just a face saving move, even though there's not much face left at all, especially after duping Gretzky and f*cking with the Great One's image.

Probably best to cut ties and move the team, but stubborn Garry, has to see his Phoenix baby work, a continued Jet's failure, and subsequent move BACK to the city it was torn from would be the ultimate Bettman black eye IMO! (so it stands to reason, he'd rather move the team to a US protetcorate before he moved it back to Winnipeg....any other team however, that would probably be fine)

Think about it, every team he's relocated (with the exception of the Jets) has actualy done quite well. Carolina is solid, Colorado won the cup the first year after they left, and then again a few years afterward. It's just been the Jet's who've failed as a moved franchise.

Expansion teams, that's a different story.

Actually, I think if an NHL team came here, for the first couple of years it would make money.

It would probably make tons of money, because there are enough people in Winnipeg willing to support it.

But, unless that team makes the playoffs both years, the "novelty" will die off...and the only "support" the team will get is corporate. Businesses buying blocks of seats (at discounted prices) to give out as employee incentives or marketing gifts. And if those businesses are fighting a poor economy, the first thing that usually goes are those "little extras".

I believe the most an owner can expect is a break-even scenario if very well managed. That is what True North brings to the party.

Any play-off games would be gravy and would likely be the difference between profitability and break-even.

But outsider (chicken little) refuses to even consider the dozens and dozens of posts that discussed this issue. Maybe if he takes his head out of his ass long enough to take a breath he might actually find some fresh air.

Manitoba post has some interesting posts on this today.

One that is impossible is that NHL will require WPG to sell 12000 season tickets in each of the first 3 years.

yeah... sure... whatever.

Manitoba Post? Heh heh he...

That said, I believe 12,000 is doable.

12000 sold as season tickets would be disgusting. that would leave barely 3500 tickets up for grabs.

but more to the point. Can you even sell season tickets 3 years ahead of time? Not, that I am aware of. So what.. they move the team here. we sell 15000 season tickets the first year, 11000 the second year... they pull the team out? bullshit.

grumpy old man wrote:I believe the most an owner can expect is a break-even scenario if very well managed. That is what True North brings to the party.

Any play-off games would be gravy and would likely be the difference between profitability and break-even.

But outsider (chicken little) refuses to even consider the dozens and dozens of posts that discussed this issue. Maybe if he takes his head out of his ass long enough to take a breath he might actually find some fresh air.

Careful there Grumps.
You might have to ban yourself for breaking YOUR OWN TERMS OF SERVICE.

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I haven't called you any names.
And I am asking for the same respect even if you do not agree with me.

Thanks..

What names? chicken little? Get lost...