if city workers strike...how will we notice?

GOM, the CPI for the 12 months ending in January 2011 was 2.3 percent for Manitoba. That does NOT including the increase in housing which depending on your stats was between 5 and 10 %.

CPI does not equal inflation

but apparently even newspapers dont understand that

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/Manitobas-inflation-rate-below-zero-64491142.html

"
WINNIPEG — Manitoba’s annual inflation rate hovered below zero for
the second straight month in September as consumers continued to reap
the benefits of lower gasoline prices.

Manitoba’sconsumer price index was pegged at minus 0.3 per cent for
the month, which was just a tick higher than August’s annual inflation
rate of minus 0.4 per cent, Statistics Canada said this morning."

and according to statscan it was 0.8 last year

http://www40.statcan.gc.ca/l01/cst01/econ09h-eng.htm

so I find it difficult to believe that there was a large enough increase in January to bring that up to 2.3

ahh better data

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quotidien/110218/t110218a2-eng.htm

MB = 2.0 to January 2011

Not much difference between 2 and 2.3. I think my numbers were national not MB specific. CPI is the closest measure to true inflation experienced by the average joe as it reflects the increase/decrease in the cost of typical household goods purchased. If you add in slyrocketing housing prices the picture gets much worse. There is now way anyone was experiencing any realworld deflationary costs last year.

The difference is more than 13%...

I wonder why the economists don't include the cost of housing in inflation? Suppose it has something to do with the value of the asset increasing (sky-rocketing)?

What about rentals GOM? Also, skyrocketing home values do impact anyone looking to get into the market ie. young families and immigrants.

I don't have the answer. But there must be something behind it...

Why not use the December numbers..CPI increase by 1.2%

grumpyrom wrote:What about rentals GOM? Also, skyrocketing home values do impact anyone looking to get into the market ie. young families and immigrants.

What about rentals? Do union members have to move every 12 months or something?

Are you really concerned about young families and immigrants, or just those with union cards?

I'm going to assume the cost of renting accommodation is included in the CPI index or the inflation rate calculation.

Pay increases and the inflation rate are very much connected. Sorta like a chicken and egg thing.

When we give annual raises tied to the inflation rate does that not guarantee the inflation rate will almost always increase?

And if we hold off issuing pay increases for a year or two will that not help keep the inflation rate somewhat in check?

So the key to controlling commodity prices and the cost of most consumer spending is to elliminate wage increases? Somehow I doubt it would work out. Your assuming that all the cost savigs would get passed on rather than padding profit margins.

Please explain what profit margins the government has.

Sorry Deank, I figure since GOM was generalizing that so should I.

Bottom line is this, IMHO I feel that any employee that has done a good enough job to earn and keep their position (meaning they were not deemed worthy of letting go) within a workplace is deserving of at minimum a fair days pay, access to a decent healthcare plan, a decent pension and an annual wage increase that is at least equivalent to the CPI. These are minimums that I feel ALL employees deserve. That some are willing to work for less is irrelevant to me, and it's their choice to work for less. I don't think people should be chastised for expecting these minimums.

It's very apparent that my viewpoint is very different from many of those on this board so I'm not going to bother arguing it anymore.

Hopefully with mediation now being requested CUPE and the City are able to resolve their differences.

Why go there? Please read my post again, carefully. Hyperbole really does not help your argument grumpyrom.

What I was asking is if we do tie annual pay increases to the inflation rate do we almost guarantee the inflation rate will increase?

And yes, I am assuming the savings will likely be kept, without increasing prices.

In my world, business, we are not raising our prices every year. We look for ways to keep our costs in check so as to NOT raise our prices and to keep competitive.

That's not always possible, but in the company I currently work for we've not increased our rates for 3 years. In the companies I previously worked for we made every effort possible to keep our prices in check. In many cases to stay competitive profit was often decreased.

That is the reality in my world. You want me to believe unions are not evil. I want you to believe business is not some evil boogieman out to rob and cheat everyone all the time.

grumpyrom wrote:Sorry Deank, I figure since GOM was generalizing that so should I.

You do see the difference between asking a question and generalizing a position don't you? You're too quick to defend your position that you feel the need to jump first on the offensive...

Freeman wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:What about rentals GOM? Also, skyrocketing home values do impact anyone looking to get into the market ie. young families and immigrants.

What about rentals? Do union members have to move every 12 months or something?

Are you really concerned about young families and immigrants, or just those with union cards?

Actually since you bring it up, I could care less about them wether they're union members or not. I mean why should I? I have a job that pays me a good wage, offers good benefits, a pension plan, and my earnings are protected from inflation by a cost of living allowance. Why should I care about young families and new immigrants or anyone else if I'm doing well?



Sorry but try as I may I just can't be that self centered.

grumpy old man wrote:Why go there? Please read my post again, carefully. Hyperbole really does not help your argument grumpyrom.

What I was asking is if we do tie annual pay increases to the inflation rate do we almost guarantee the inflation rate will increase?

And yes, I am assuming the savings will likely be kept, without increasing prices.

In my world, business, we are not raising our prices every year. We look for ways to keep our costs in check so as to NOT raise our prices and to keep competitive.

That's not always possible, but in the company I currently work for we've not increased our rates for 3 years. In the companies I previously worked for we made every effort possible to keep our prices in check. In many cases to stay competitive profit was often decreased.

That is the reality in my world. You want me to believe unions are not evil. I want you to believe business is not some evil boogieman out to rob and cheat everyone all the time.

Then we just have to continue to disagree then....no hurt feelings GOM. That's just not my personal experience, just as your experience and opinion of unions is completely opposite to mine.

No harm in that.

"Bottom line is this, IMHO I feel that any employee that has done a good
enough job to earn and keep their position (meaning they were not deemed
worthy of letting go) within a workplace is deserving of at minimum a
fair days pay, access to a decent healthcare plan, a decent pension and
an annual wage increase that is at least equivalent to the CPI. These
are minimums that I feel ALL employees deserve. That some are willing to
work for less is irrelevant to me, and it's their choice to work for
less. I don't think people should be chastised for expecting these
minimums."

Seems reasonable. Also seems to me the only way to get a raise above CPI SHOULD be exceptional performance by that specific employee.

Trouble is we are not talking about the non unionized folk where for the most part that is true. We are talking about unions where everyone gets the same raise and performance has nothing to do with promotion.

grumpyrom wrote:Bottom line is this, IMHO I feel that any employee that has done a good enough job to earn and keep their position (meaning they were not deemed worthy of letting go) within a workplace is deserving of at minimum a fair days pay, access to a decent healthcare plan, a decent pension and an annual wage increase that is at least equivalent to the CPI. These are minimums that I feel ALL employees deserve. That some are willing to work for less is irrelevant to me, and it's their choice to work for less. I don't think people should be chastised for expecting these minimums.

Then it should be encumbent on them to go out and get a job that provides that, even young families and immigrants.