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the winnipeg sandbox » winnipeg sports... » other sports discussion... » Livs idea taking hold?

Livs idea taking hold?

+3
rosencrentz
grumpy old man
Deank
7 posters

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1Livs idea taking hold? Empty Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:53 pm

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

"Or the football club could issue public shares in the team and see the Bombers truly become community-owned. Katz has been praising this idea since 2006, when he got into an oversight dispute with former club president Lyle Bauer."


http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/stadium-aint-dead-yet-103229789.html


2Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:58 pm

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

Can the community raise $150 million to build a new stadium? Are there 30,000 people/investor groups willing to spring $5,000 each?

Will that $5,000 investment hold its' value?

3Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:25 pm

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Selling the team on the open market is somehow now being touted as it then becoming "community owned"??? Just like MTS is I reckon.

The team will be privately owned if it is sold albeit by members of the community....but that's not community owned for chrissake!!

4Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:28 pm

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

I don't think it is really community owned now. The structure currently in place is quite baffling. How do I get elected to the board of governors? How do unconnected peeps become elected?

To "sell" the team creates a true community ownership structure IMO. It would be very interesting to see how that would manifest itself.

5Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:29 pm

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

*sigh*

6Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:56 pm

rosencrentz

rosencrentz
uber-contributor
uber-contributor

"What me worry?"

http://www.elansofas.com

7Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 7:11 pm

Livio

Anonymous
Guest

This is how it could manifest itself.

The price you pay would lead to lower season tickets and also make use of your RRSP money. Just a way to invest in your City and leave a legacy to your family.

8Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 7:15 pm

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Livio wrote:This is how it could manifest itself.

The price you pay would lead to lower season tickets and also make use of your RRSP money. Just a way to invest in your City and leave a legacy to your family.


http://members.shaw.ca/WinnipegStadium/


9Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:38 pm

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

"I don't think it is really community owned now. The structure currently in place is quite baffling. How do I get elected to the board of governors? How do unconnected peeps become elected?"

Kneepads

10Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:26 am

AGEsAces

AGEsAces
moderator
moderator

The only problem with selling shares though...is that shares get bought/sold.

So answer this...
You own a company and buy 10 shares for $5k each ($50k) (cause most personal investors won't fork that much over).

A BIG company comes along (say CanadInns) and offers you $10k each for your 10 shares, thus doubling your investment...would you take it?

Now, say they did that for multiple investors?
Or say they bought a "majority" of the shares through their direct company, or through subsidiary companies...NOW who owns the team?

It would only be able to work if there were limitations put on the purchase of the shares, ie. no one entity (individual, corporation, parent-corp) could own more than "X" number of shares.

It will take longer to sell them...but it would protect the team indefinitely from having someone control a majority.

http://www.photage.ca

11Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:32 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

yes sir comrade AA

12Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:35 am

AGEsAces

AGEsAces
moderator
moderator

Deank wrote:yes sir comrade AA

Hey...don't get me wrong...I like the proposal...I just see it as a back-door way of someone scooping up the team to control it...with the permission of the public.

If I had the money...I'd buy some "seats" myself...but I would probably be inclined to sell if offered the right amount...unless my return was guaranteed in some way indefinitely.

http://www.photage.ca

13Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:37 am

Livio

Anonymous
Guest

AgeAces, you don't go the share structure, and even if you do, yes you can put in a shareholders rights plan or "poison pill "

I much prefer the fractional ownership, where you basically own "property". But yes, those can be traded.

GreenBay has shares but no real market, subsequently a black market for shares has opened up but there is zero risk someone can acquire enough shares , legally, to control the team.

14Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:45 am

LivingDead

LivingDead
general-contributor
general-contributor

grumpy old man wrote:Can the community raise $150 million to build a new stadium? Are there 30,000 people/investor groups willing to spring $5,000 each?

Will that $5,000 investment hold its' value?

How much did the community fork over to help Gail build her Monument?

How much $$ would a 1% tax on all purchases within city limits generate? Would a majority of winnipeggers support the bombers and vote yes to a temperary 1% sales tax to pay for a top notch stadium?

The fine people of Grand Forks, ND voted to have a tax pay for their stadium/arena.

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare

15Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:50 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

" 1% tax on all purchases within city limits generate?"

according to sam about 114 mill per year

16Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:04 am

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

I like the way they do that in the US. Usually a plebiscite is held and if peeps vote yes then away they go. Good idea IMO.

17Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:23 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

the plebiscite in grand forks (or was it fargo?) took 3 or 4 attempts before it passed (ie was shoved down the throats of the majority of the populace)

18Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:25 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

I don't believe that the people are always right, so, I'm not so sure about plebicites personally.

Voting can present an entire other list of problems...remember the Quebec question thingy.

But we do need a more direct and open look at the Bomber board.

19Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:26 am

Livio

Anonymous
Guest

Hell, why not raise it 2% , thats 228 million.

taxes, just a lazy way to do things.

You want a stadium, pony up. Or do we just use the Term "UserPay" when its convenient.

Not everyone wants to pay more sales tax for a Stadium.

20Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:30 am

Bartron

Bartron
major-contributor
major-contributor

Deank wrote:the plebiscite in grand forks (or was it fargo?) took 3 or 4 attempts before it passed (ie was shoved down the throats of the majority of the populace)

I think it was Fargo, the arena in Grand Forks is owned by the Ralph Engelstad foundation I believe.

21Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:30 am

Livio

Anonymous
Guest

Agree JTF, Bauer and his crew had over a decade to leverage a Free site to their advantage. No imagination or creativity. The board whoever they are, or get elected is piss poor and if the City is guaranteeing something ( I think Lyle's pay was ) then we should reconsider what exactly community owned means.....by the way, what Does it mean ?


This board is completely ineffectual and has proven itself incapable of managing the Bomber finances.

22Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 11:37 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

The Bomber board should be doing what Asker is doing imo.

23Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:30 pm

LivingDead

LivingDead
general-contributor
general-contributor

Bartron wrote:
Deank wrote:the plebiscite in grand forks (or was it fargo?) took 3 or 4 attempts before it passed (ie was shoved down the throats of the majority of the populace)

I think it was Fargo, the arena in Grand Forks is owned by the Ralph Engelstad foundation I believe.

The aleris center is public. The engelstad stadium is for the college football. and is located on the grounds of UND in Grand Forks

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare

24Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 12:31 pm

LivingDead

LivingDead
general-contributor
general-contributor

If the government can fund Special Intrest groups and Artists. Then Fair is Fair and they can fund Sports. Sport is the artistry of the human body in motion.

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare

25Livs idea taking hold? Empty Re: Livs idea taking hold? Mon Sep 20, 2010 2:19 pm

Bartron

Bartron
major-contributor
major-contributor

LivingDead wrote:
Bartron wrote:
Deank wrote:the plebiscite in grand forks (or was it fargo?) took 3 or 4 attempts before it passed (ie was shoved down the throats of the majority of the populace)

I think it was Fargo, the arena in Grand Forks is owned by the Ralph Engelstad foundation I believe.

The aleris center is public. The engelstad stadium is for the college football. and is located on the grounds of UND in Grand Forks


I was talking about Ralph Engelstad arena. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Engelstad_Arena it's definitely not used for football.

The alerus center is used for football.

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