hydro might go on strike!

http://www.winnipegsun.com/money/2009/10/01/11221726-sun.html

oh but wait we are safe "the roughly 1,000 managers at Hydro will pick up the slack "
Holy FRICKEN HELL!!! 1000 managers? WTF???

Hell...why don't they make everyone a manager...that'll frick up the union eh.

1000 managers for 4600 employees?

Good plan JTF! :-)

Damn...that IBEW sounds really inflexible. I mean they've only been working since April without a contract, and there demands are completely outrageous if you ask me. The nerve of them to ask for more than a 2% wage increase over TWO years. I mean that's almost half the cost of inflation, what more do those greedy union bastards want?

grumpyrom wrote:Damn...that IBEW sounds really inflexible. I mean they've only been working since April without a contract, and there demands are completely outrageous if you ask me. The nerve of them to ask for more than a 2% wage increase over TWO years. I mean that's almost half the cost of inflation, what more do those greedy union bastards want?

yes the Nerve of them. For your sake and reading pleasure, I will hold back my usual anti-union comments.

Know what I got for a raise this year? I got a "WAGE FREEZE" no cost of living adjustment, nothing. But I managed to keep my job.

same here. no raise this year.. why? oh right THE FREAKIN ECONOMY

Deank wrote:same here. no raise this year.. why? oh right THE FREAKIN ECONOMY

IBEW didn't get the memo.

grumpyrom wrote:I mean that's almost half the cost of inflation, what more do those greedy union bastards want?

Ummm, really? I'd read where some months there was actually DEFLATION! Yikes. Will the union give money back in the event of deflation?

http://www.calgaryherald.com/business/Alberta+leads+nation+with+cent+inflation+rate+drop/2004013/story.html

And please help me understand the significance of working since April without a contract? Really? The indignity!

Deank wrote:same here. no raise this year.. why? oh right THE FREAKIN ECONOMY

Unless your employer failed to generate a profit, and froze wages for all staff including management and executives, and cut out all bonus's then there's no reason for you not to see a raise just because of THE FREAKIN ECONOMY.

Way too many companies have used the genereal state of the economy as an excuse to horde profits, and apparently there's plenty of people willing to fall for it.

Despite the economy, my employer continues to generate a healthy 10% net profit an increase of almost 3% from 2008. I have no doubt in my mind that if our contract was up for renewal we would be hearing about demands for a wage freeze due to THE FREAKING ECONOMY. All the while the CEO would continue to get his $20 million bonus, NBU employee would still get their annual bonus pay....but those union types they'd be the ones who are unreasonable for refusing to drop wages because of THE FREAKING ECONOMY.

GIVE ME A BREAK!

My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

grumpy old man wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:I mean that's almost half the cost of inflation, what more do those greedy union bastards want?

Ummm, really? I'd read where some months there was actually DEFLATION! Yikes. Will the union give money back in the event of deflation?

http://www.calgaryherald.com/business/Alberta+leads+nation+with+cent+inflation+rate+drop/2004013/story.html

And please help me understand the significance of working since April without a contract? Really? The indignity!

The significance being that it's an agreed upon date after which NEITHER party is obligated to honour the conditions of the old agreement. At that date the union can choose to walk out, or the company can choose to lock them out. NEITHER must agree to anything in the old contract. The fact that both parties choose to continue to honur the old agreement shows some degree of good will on both sides. If the union was half as unreasonable assome of you claim they would have just walked out at midnight on the last day of the agreement and forced Hydro's hand.

The fact they didn't for 5 months implies to me that they were trying to negotiate a fair settlement without a labour disruption.

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

Oh yeah. profits are evil in your world. But we've had this debate before haven't we?

I say go start your own company. Invest your own money in it. Work the hours needed to be profitable or just to break even. Take ALL the risks.

Then come back and tell us why too many companies are evil and don't deserve their monstrous 10% profit.

frick it, if all my employees were like you I'd shut the business and invest my money for that 10% return. That way I would not have to deal with people that have such attitudes as yours grumpyrom.

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

My executive Dad was also educated...was your Dad? I'm sure your dad received OT did he not? My Dad never received OT, he worked hard and long stressful hours.

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

I suspect you were not directing that rant at me. I have indeed worked as you describe...

grumpy old man wrote:Oh yeah. profits are evil in your world. But we've had this debate before haven't we?

I say go start your own company. Invest your own money in it. Work the hours needed to be profitable or just to break even. Take ALL the risks.

Then come back and tell us why too many companies are evil and don't deserve their monstrous 10% profit.

frick it, if all my employees were like you I'd shut the business and invest my money for that 10% return. That way I would not have to deal with people that have such attitudes as yours grumpyrom.

Not once have I ever said that profits are evil. I stated that many companies are using the state of the GENERAL economy as an EXCUSE to extract consessions from their employees despite the financial picture at their particular business.

If the economy is not inpacting your bottom line, is it fair to demand wage freezes etc. while you continue to dole out increases and bonus to senior level management and above?

Not in my world. I'm trying to avoid the race to the bottom so many of you seem to be stuck in.

grumpy old man wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

I suspect you were not directing that rant at me. I have indeed worked as you describe...

LOL..no not directed at you....

Goth_chic wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

My executive Dad was also educated...was your Dad? I'm sure your dad received OT did he not? My Dad never received OT, he worked hard and long stressful hours.

Nope, he came to Canada with a trade school degree and unable to speak a word of English. He's earned a decent middle class income by virtue of his work ethic. He's also in the process I'm sure earned his employer many times over his wages over the last 30 years in profit. Does he deserve a raise or bonus any LESS than your senior exectuve dad by virtue of his job title and education level?

Gee, just like the millions and millions of immigrants before him eh???

Different job skills are compensated at different salary levels. Even in unions this is true. Why do you begrudge someone the ability to earn more for the value they bring to the business?

In your world should not a skilled plumber earn significantly more than a general labourer?

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

My executive Dad was also educated...was your Dad? I'm sure your dad received OT did he not? My Dad never received OT, he worked hard and long stressful hours.

Nope, he came to Canada with a trade school degree and unable to speak a word of English. He's earned a decent middle class income by virtue of his work ethic. He's also in the process I'm sure earned his employer many times over his wages over the last 30 years in profit. Does he deserve a raise or bonus any LESS than your senior exectuve dad by virtue of his job title and education level?

Well actually yes he deserves less. My Dad worked full time while attending U of M in the evening and on Saturdays. He also had a wife and 2 small children. He bettered himself so he could give us the kind of life he never had. Why would anyone go to University to make the same as someone who didn't? That sounds like Communism to me...

grumpyrom wrote:Not once have I ever said that profits are evil.

No. What you said was: "Way too many companies have used the genereal state of the economy as an excuse to horde profits" I read that to mean you believe profits are evil.

grumpyrom wrote:If the economy is not inpacting your bottom line, is it fair to demand wage freezes etc. while you continue to dole out increases and bonus to senior level management and above?

Nyes. You generalize, of course. I guess you can paint every business with exactly the same brush as anti-unionists do with all unions.
Don't assume all businesses are HUGE mega-businesses paying their CEOs obscene gobs of money. Most companies are small businesses. Many owners take nothing home while people like you take a nice wage home.

In general it is smart business to save up for a rainy day. If the economy is tanking, and there is no real sign it will improve right away, it is imprudent to spend money on pay increases today and possibly not have cash on hand in the future to ride out even shakier times.
But I guess union brothers and sisters are only concerned in the here and now.

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

Tradespeople are not lowly.....they are some of the highest income earners out there these days

Miz point wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

Tradespeople are not lowly.....they are some of the highest income earners out there these days

This is not directed at any one. nor at you Miz Point.

I could easily go back to U of M upgrade, get designations. Work up the corporate ladder and make huge salaries and collect huge bonuses.
But some things are more important to me, spending time with my family, the relative stress free job I have. I dont earn what Unionized employee's make. I dont care.
What I do care about is that at my job. everybody works as a team and dog frickers get the boot. In other words I have a work place that is Fair.

I was a member of the BCTGM Local 389. and I was a member of the International Union of Painters and Allied Trades Union Local 739

As you all know, I am anti-Union 100%

grumpyrom wrote:

Deank wrote:same here. no raise this year.. why? oh right THE FREAKIN ECONOMY

Unless your employer failed to generate a profit, and froze wages for all staff including management and executives, and cut out all bonus's then there's no reason for you not to see a raise just because of THE FREAKIN ECONOMY.

Way too many companies have used the genereal state of the economy as an excuse to horde profits, and apparently there's plenty of people willing to fall for it.

Despite the economy, my employer continues to generate a healthy 10% net profit an increase of almost 3% from 2008. I have no doubt in my mind that if our contract was up for renewal we would be hearing about demands for a wage freeze due to THE FREAKING ECONOMY. All the while the CEO would continue to get his $20 million bonus, NBU employee would still get their annual bonus pay....but those union types they'd be the ones who are unreasonable for refusing to drop wages because of THE FREAKING ECONOMY.

GIVE ME A BREAK!

all wages are frozen. As well there will be no bonuses this year. Thankfully NO LAYOFFS EITHER!

Goth_chic wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:

grumpyrom wrote:

Goth_chic wrote:My Dad was an executive and made a ton of money, he received very generous bonuses. He worked his FREAKIN ASS OFF. He was paid for 37.5 hours per week but put in over 60 per week, he was always working on weekends, flying away on business etc etc. He deserved every FREAKIN penny. So GOM until you've walked in the shoes of an executive do not speak about what you do not know.

What makes you think that non-executives dont work their asses off? My father is a lowly trades person, has never belonged to a union, and has never worked less than a 60 hour week in his life. Does that mean he deserves a raise or bonus any more or less than your executive dad?

My executive Dad was also educated...was your Dad? I'm sure your dad received OT did he not? My Dad never received OT, he worked hard and long stressful hours.

Nope, he came to Canada with a trade school degree and unable to speak a word of English. He's earned a decent middle class income by virtue of his work ethic. He's also in the process I'm sure earned his employer many times over his wages over the last 30 years in profit. Does he deserve a raise or bonus any LESS than your senior exectuve dad by virtue of his job title and education level?

Well actually yes he deserves less. My Dad worked full time while attending U of M in the evening and on Saturdays. He also had a wife and 2 small children. He bettered himself so he could give us the kind of life he never had. Why would anyone go to University to make the same as someone who didn't? That sounds like Communism to me...

That's not the question I asked Goth. Obviously not every job is deserving of the same wages. I asked if he is any more or less deserving of a raise or bonus? Wages had nothing to do with the question.