Motor Coach workers vote for strike action

Winnipeg Sun Workers at Winnipeg's Motor Coach Industries have voted in favour of a strike.

After rejecting a contract offer by the company, 93% of the 700 workers -- including welders, painters and maintenance staff -- cast ballots approving a walkout.

The union, local 1953 of the International Association of Machinists, says a major point of contention is that MCI wants to contract out many services.

The company's offer included wage increases of 11% over three years and a $1,250 signing bonus.

In a letter to its staff, MCI says it believes they have presented "a very good offer," especially during a global recession that is impacting manufacturing industries.

MCI is also undergoing a restructuring plan in an effort to shed $420 million of debt.

The company is the largest manufacturer of coaches for the tour, charter and commuter transit sectors in the U.S. and Canada.

Is the timing here good, bad or meh? Add in the $1250 bonus, is an almost 4% annual increase a decent wage hike?

I don't know what these trades peeps earn but Motor Coach is considering outsourcing certain things like painting. Certainly one can understand a company attempting to contain or lower costs in an effort to remain competitive (especially in light of the buy American mindset by our neighbours) and grow profits/reduce debt.

I'd say their timing could not be worse. Perhaps a better solution is to work with Motor Coach to ensure they keep their doors open and sell more buses in a time where bus sales and protectionism are growing.

unbelievable...no actually I can believe it, I just cant understand why a union would care so little about actually keeping its jobs that it would rather strike to prove a point.

I can understand why the union might be against contracting out some jobs, but as long as it does mean any employees would be terminated whats the problem?

Crazy... If someone isn't paid enough, all he has to do is search for another job. I bet the 7% who are for the new contract will be the first to get the boot... Keep the jobs and get back to work, is what I say. These unionists are pure crap. If the MCI wants to expand outwards, that'll mean maybe they want to invest, expand, and dominate the market further, instead of falling behind... The safe job haven is now over. If you work, you get paid, if you play union monopoly, you go home.
My Sunday's two cents worth.

The way I read into it, MCI is basically offering them a big carrot in hopes of getting the contract through so that in the long term they can sub-contract out more jobs and bust the union at some point in the future. Good for the members who work their to see through the offer and look at the long term picture, which would eventually see many of their jobs dissapearing to contractors. In the end their decision impacts only them, so I don't think anyone has the right to bash their legal right to turn down the companies offer.
It's a negotiation and I'm sure many would take a smaller wage increase and smaller bonus in return for language that eliminates outsourcing opportunities. Sometimes it's not about money, although that's usually what the media focusses on.
I know my point of view isn't shared by many on this board.

This is all about one Union fighting another. imo

If they "outsource" painting, for example, the new company will still be unionized I'm sure. (Are there any large painting companies that aren't unionized?)

How often have we seen companies close a place when the union doesn't come to the table with a realistic offer?

Classic case of winning a battle (the union didn't give in eh) and losing the war (the plant shuts down and there is NO WORK anymore).

MC!, from what I understand is pretty busy. One of the people who works for mr, her husband works there as a welder. Not much overtime, but steady well paid ($25 per hour?).
I bet you it is the contracting out that is the problem.
If you contract out the painting, maybe the next thing is the welding, and the next thing is every job goes to the cheapest bidder.
That is a very effective way of keeeping the costs down.
I saw an ad for a 2009 Grand Caravan at $17,957 yesterday. In 1990 I purchased a brand new Grand Caravan, and paid about $22,500. 19 years of improvements and the price is 28% cheaper? Lots of made in China, Mexico parts no doubt!

What's the point of being a highly paid unionized worker that is unemployed?

Why does the threat of closing the doors alway's have to come into play when talking about unions? I don't think that MCI is going to suddenly close it's Winnipeg operations because the union is trying to keep them from contracting out as many of their member's jobs as possible (though I could be wrong). Why so much disdain for unions when they strike, but none for companies who use the threat of closure as a bargaining tactic? I don't see much difference. Both are legitimate negotiatiing tactics. In the end if the employer feels the best thing to do is to close the doors and move, then they'll do that regardless of any unions attempt to sway them otherwise.


I just think the IAM members saw through the offer for what it is, an attempt to circumvent the collective bargaining agreement in the long term. Generally companies that are unionized don't sub-contract work out to other union labour as their is no real savings to be had in this fashion. My bet would be that they are looking to sub-contract out maintenance jobs to some property management company that pays much lower wages, and to bring in new painters that are "sub-contractors" and not employees of MCI.

Like Rosen pointed out, after that what's next? Pretty soon no job classification is safe and you have a plant full of sub-contractors. At that point the company has effectively broken the union, and all you've managed to do is replace good paying middle class jobs with more poverty level wages. Great for the local economy eh?


This only becomes a long downhil slide, as union members are laid off only to see their jobs replaced by new "sub-contractors". It's really just a shell game on the employers part, and a race to the bottom for all employees in the long run.

My point is that the unions are out for themselves, and don't care about the workers. It's been that way for years.

The union will gladly sacrifice workers for a principal. They do it all the time.

The plant closes, but the union didn't budge from their position...ya. That's smart.

JTF wrote:What's the point of being a highly paid unionized worker that is unemployed?

What's the point of being a loyal employee for 20 years if your employer is just going to turn around and sell your job to the lowest bidder at the soonest opportunity?

Retrian yourself then. No one owes anybody anything. You work. You get paid. Anything else id a bonus eh.

JTF, that may be true sometimes but do you honestly think that's the case in this contract? Seems to me like it's a clear cut issue of job security vs. higher wages. The employees would rather turn down the wage increase in return for no sub-contracing out of their current jobs. That doesn't exactly sound like the greedy unionized worker to me.

Perhaps we're stereotyping a bit too much.

JTF wrote:Retrian yourself then. No one owes anybody anything. You work. You get paid. Anything else id a bonus eh.

The motto of the true capitalist! What happened to giving a sh1t about the people who work for you, and line your pockets? What happened to giving back to the communities that back a lot of these companies with huge tax breaks and incentives, only to see them shut doors as soon as cheaper labour becomes available in some 3rd world nation?

Like I said maybe I look at the European model a bit too much of how to treat employees, rather than the model down south.

My question was "is now a good time to push for more than 11% and $1250"? Seems very generous given the current economic climate.

Is it inevitable when the company and union sign the contract jobs are immediately farmed out? If the union believes that, is it inevitable that will happen? If yes why not work with the company to save the jobs?

Why is the company always portrayed as evil when it attempts to lower costs? What is so intrinsically wrong with that? If Motor Coach does not remain competitive will it lose business to competitors in Mexico or the US? How is that good for the union members here in Winnipeg.

A union game of chicken could seriously hurt those workers.

grumpyrom wrote:Seems to me like it's a clear cut issue of job security vs. higher wages.

I did not see that in the article. I'm sure there is more to the story than written in that article. But is job security the prime impetus for rejecting the contract offer? Seems odd then that the focus is wages.

Is capitalism a bad thing? Seems BILLIONS of peeps living today owe capitalism a great big thanks. Many of us, including Manitobans, enjoy a very nice lifestyle as a result.

I believe that socialism and communism don't work particularly well. Show me a TRUE socialist or communist country that enjoys similar lifestyle. Yeah, show me a successful socialist country that does not fully exploit capitalism to its fullest.

I always thought that if you pay somebody for work that is performed for you, your obligation ended.

In all the companies that I've had, never once have I ever thought that the people that worked for me were my partners. I've always considered them to be employees.

However, the unions seem to think otherwise.

The other thing to consider...is regulations have made it impossible to maintain quality control with employees and ESPECIALLY with Unions.

If one of the MCI Painters does a poor job when painting...what's the recourse? You can't really fire him for one poor job, he's union. You can't deduct the cost of fixing it from his pay...it's against Labour Code. You can't even really punish the guy by making him janitor for a week...cause it's against Union policy.

By subcontracting work out to other companies though, if a bus comes back with a poor paint job, you can demand compensation. You can stop payment on a cheque until it's fixed. You have recourse, and it doesn't come out of your own pocket.

If you have 10 painters: Are all equal? Are all painters capable of performing the same quality job day in and day out?

If the answer is yes then the union has a point when suggesting seniority is the only thing that matters.

We all know that all painters are not created equally. Therefore how does one reward the better workers? If layoffs are required can the low quality/bad attitude workers be laid off first and the quality workers last if at all?

Considering that MCI is an American owned company and the Obama administration in the US has stated that they want to buy American, if the local MCI union is not careful, the plant here may be shut down all together and move everything to Pembina ND. The company I work for does a great deal of business with MCI and this has always been a talking point in the Wpg Admin office of MCI. And the employees who have been at MCI for any length of time (10 years +) are making much more than $25.00 an hour. And when the parent company is in Chapter 11 in the US and the employees are not willing to accept an 11% increase over 3 years + 1250 signing bonus, I call that plain and simple greed on the part of the union. Most companies in Canada are either laying off employees, selling off, going into bankruptcy protection or just giving a cost of living increase if any increase at all so these folks should count themselves lucky to still be employed at MCI in Canada.

MCI, I don't think could operate out of Grand Forks, because they have a need for hundreds of trained personnel.
I also don't think that the antagonistic comments against the union leaders is warranted. Offers are made, and the workers vote!
Obviously there is something in the offer from the company that does not work for the workers!
93% is quite a strong message to the company.
I will check with my co-worker, non-unionized, and see if she knows what the problem is with her husbands co-workers at MCI.

Oh, they (USA) have millions of trained personnel, Anyone in the auto business can easily move from state to state for a (better) job. Doesn't this happen in Canada???

The entire coach assembly is done here in Transcona, then the buses are flatbedded to Pembina North Dakota for engine and electrical work. I know for a fact that North Dakota would welcome the entire operation down south. Very sad to see the union trying this stunt again, with so many out of work they should just be thankful the members still have jobs. Alot of Transcona people would be devastated if the union ruins this.

Yes these workers should give there heads a collective shake .