Northend violence

so it includes parts of point douglas then?

holly.. can you check the link to see if that covers it?

Map looks pretty accurate and yes Point Douglas north of the tracks is considered part of the north end same as the Scotia St area close to St Johns Park is also considered North End and the Florence Nightingale development is in the North End. Some maps include all of the Inkster Industrial Park, some don't but we are mainly talking residential.

thanks holy

Well all.... let me know if you think the map needs any tweeks or if anyone wants any other areas of the city added. Feel free to share with whomever you want.

NOTE for the search feature to work you must be logged into Google and save it as a map in your profile.

holly golightly wrote: At least when I sit out on my front porch in the summer I know who my neighbours are and we speak to one another and watch out for one another. Can that same be said about your neighbours in other areas??????? Most, but not all, like to keep to themselves for fear of having to acknowledge a neoghbour. I have lived in a more "affluent" area in North Kildonan and came back to the north end because of the community aspect of it and the lack of community in the neighbourhood I left.

I know my neighbours....I felt there was less community in the north end when I lived there as an adult. When I was a kid my parents were heavily involved in the community centre...which was Northwood and Sinclair Park. I just didn't see that kind of community when I moved back as an adult. I see more of a community in the Maples where I reside now.

Well I guess there are pockets of the north end that are not friendly and neighbourly but we all have to take responsibility for our actions and if needed make the first step to become a neighbour. If your neighbours choose not to acknowledge the offering then youhave done your part and it is their loss, not yours. Where I live (which is pretty hard core as far as th North End goes) we have been there for 20 years and save for a few homes, we have had the same neighbours for those 20 years and the newer families that have moved in are the children of the previous residents so we are very fortunate. The other part of our block is developed through the North End Housing and the families that are there are very stable, hard working families who are willing to set up roots and raise their families in this neighbourhood because of the atmosphere of togetherness. I guess as the saying goes, "to each his own" my preference will always be the North End.

You can pull the north boundary up to Inkster Blvd between the Red and McPhillips. Point Douglas to me IS part of the inner original core of the North End. I'd say the centre would be the corner of Main and Sutherland. Anyone disagree?

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/story/4248781p-4892036c.html

did a search.. yup its in the blue.

I liked living in the north end before having kids. I just didn't want to raise my kids in that neighbourhood. If I had my way I'd be raising them in a small town.

Goth_chic wrote:I liked living in the north end before having kids. I just didn't want to raise my kids in that neighbourhood. If I had my way I'd be raising them in a small town.

same here...though I hear the small towns are getting the same problems. kids who are bored and thus committing crime/vandalism.

To me, Winnipeg IS a small town...but the problems are so condensed in pocket areas...it's hard to fix anything without drastic measures. Plus there seems to be the collection of criminals who are doing the crimes because they actually enjoy it...and nobody is willing to stand up to them or shut them down...permanently.

But if you remove yourself from the problem areas and not try to fix these problem, you yourself are part of the problem in that you are ignoring it and letting it continue and manifest. If you stay to make the neighbourhood stable you are making it known that you want to help fix the problem. Stability in neighbourhoods is what the criminal element do not want as they then know that they have won. Look at how the residents in North Point Douglas have "beaten" the crack dealers out of their neighbourhood because they, the residents, decided to stay and fight for what they thought was the right thing to do and make the neighbourhood stable.

holly golightly wrote:But if you remove yourself from the problem areas and not try to fix these problem, you yourself are part of the problem in that you are ignoring it and letting it continue and manifest. If you stay to make the neighbourhood stable you are making it known that you want to help fix the problem. Stability in neighbourhoods is what the criminal element do not want as they then know that they have won. Look at how the residents in North Point Douglas have "beaten" the crack dealers out of their neighbourhood because they, the residents, decided to stay and fight for what they thought was the right thing to do and make the neighbourhood stable.

That comes down to tolerance.

If it was JUST me, or just my wife and I...we could probably stay where we are and not worry about it.

But we have a child to consider. And when we see children ages 8-12 sitting across the street smoking cigarettes that they probably stole from their parents. When we see them breaking bottles in the streets. When we actually go knock on their doors and tell their parents of some vandalism they committed...and are told "what do you want me to do about it" by their parents. Then that's an environment I don't want my child growing up in. Because peer-pressure is a powerful thing...and something most parents cannot fight...at least not without the help of the other parents.

My neighborhood has gotten better over the last 5 years. There's enough new people that the scum we saw when we moved in then have moved along...but there are still problems...and nothing you can do to get rid of them...short of becoming them and burning down the dumps they live in.

You're right holy. It is a catch 22 though is it not? Stay, fight and fix it, maybe. Stay, don't fight, and maybe child gets sucked into the culture. Or leave and let someone else handle it.

...risk your life and property, too...
These problems should be the focus of city council, not just a couple of nearby residents...
If city council can't or won't intervene, then have them resign. Next elections, pick someone who can do the job right.

We'll have to agree to disagree because there are things that you can do to make these parents act responsibly. If you talk to them and they come back at you and say "what do you want me to do" then you go that next step and report them to the police, social services, CFS, etc. And yes peer pressure is a bitch but you as a parent can be even better and show them the consequenses of their actions, be pro-active. I have raised 3 children from the ages of 4,2 and new born in the same neighbourhood (William Whyte area to be exact) and although none of them are angels, all 3 graduated from high school, all 3 are contributing individuals who have jobs and all 3 still live in the neighbourhood because they choose to. They are now 24, 22 and 20 so they grew up in the midst of the IP gang assault on the North End as well as the influx of the Hells Angels in the North End so it is possible to raise "good" children in "bad" neighbourhoods. It is up to the parents to be the role models for the children and set those boundaries and teach them the respect for themselves. And if you show to your children that you respect them and then in turn show a bit of respect and caring to the neighbourhood children, change will happen, but you have to start somewhere and moving away from it is not always the answer. Some one once said "it takes a village to raise a child" and I think we are all lossing sight of that concept. Just my humble opinion.

"and moving away from it is not always the answer. Some "

and sometimes it is.

But the problem is spreading...

no...you can't threaten them with police or CFS.

#1 - CFS probably won't do anything
#2 - they know police will just let them go
#3 - you then become a target, because they tell all their criminal friends. you start to find things stolen, broken, damaged, etc.

I built a gate between our house and the one next door (with permission from that owner) to keep people from passing between the houses from the back lane to the street. The night I put it up, some scumbag teens came through and kicked it down. My wife saw them do it, but couldn't catch them or do anything.
I rebuilt the gate, stronger this time the next day.
When she saw them in the neighborhood again, she pointed them out. I confronted them and told them I know they kicked my gate down, and that fortunately they didn't do any serious damage, or I would be charging them and their parents for the cost of replacing it and for repairs. But that if I found anything else damaged or broken around my house, I would be knocking on their door, whether I thought they did it or not.
That night, I sat on our front porch and waited...and sure enough they came from the back lane between our houses. As they got closer I calmly leaned over our rail and told them to "turn around...go back the way you came...come through this way again and I will shoot you for trespassing". (I don't own a gun...so it was an idle threat). They did, and I haven't seen or heard from them again.

But...had they not...and I had acted (as I was prepared to do)...then what? I get arrested because some scum decides it's ok to trespass and destroy property? And how serious should my defense be? They had not raped or murdered anyone...but they were destroying my property (and my neighbors)...quite honestly I was willing to break a leg or two...and probably would've thought that too lenient. And then I become a target again for those three and their friends when they are drunk or high and looking to cause problems...as does my family.

I'm not honestly allowed to shoot them...put everyone out of their misery...but obviously the warning didn't work...and most likely because they know nothing will happen to them.

And ...chances are better now that if you tried the same now as you did then.. one of them might actually be carrying and decide to not give you the chance.

What really needs to happen is some examples made.

That's what the concept of prisons were...to incarcerate those who may be rehabed...but make it a deterrent by being so miserable that noone would want to go there.

Criminals today think of it as a vacation. A period of time where if they are hardup, they can escape and get free room and board, and food, and tv, and a place to workout, and medical attention...hell...I've had times in my life where that actually sounded appealing...despite being locked up.

I won't even bring the death penalty into this...since that's an entirely different argument...but some sort of detterant is required. Stop babying those in lockup. Stop catering to them. MAKE them work for their board...if they don't...make a worse example of them. A few beatings never hurt anyone

And if the criminal is under 18 or living at home...take their parents with them too...lock them all up together...no tv, no games. Food should be just enough to keep them alive...showers should be hose downs with cold water....and they should have to shave their bodies, head to toe, to help reduce bugs & lice.

and put it all on live TV and have people voted off each week!

That's heaven, compared to some houses in the North End...

Deank wrote:and put it all on live TV and have people voted off each week!

North End Survivor
or
Back Lane Survivor

Holly I am glad you like the north end, I am glad you raised your children there. I chose not to. When I was a kid in the 1970's, the north end was fine. Things have changed, and not for the better. As long as you have parents who don't give a sh!t you will have bad kids.

I don't know if I'm in the North End though...probably considered the "West End" Arlington & Ellice area.

But either way...it's the same WPS that won't do anything, the same court system that lets the criminals walk, the same jails that don't actually punish anyone.

call it
the redeemers

because the only way out is to redeem themselves