Remember remember .. eleven September

That's called money. Lot's of it - and with conditions that involve the security of your life and family.

If nothing else these conspiracy theories get a laugh out of me. We all know what really happened, end of discussion.

Jondo wrote:That's called money. Lot's of it - and with conditions that involve the security of your life and family.

What conditions that involve the security of my life and family?

That should have read "their" not "your".

To all those here that hold onto an uninformed and without-out basis belief that 9/11 events were as officially claimed - here's a great synopsis that describes that reactionary dynamic.

"For the many thousands of us who have spent long hours researching 9/11 (try Googling "9/11 cover-up"), we have found that the problem we are facing is not in finding solid facts and information disproving the official story. We have an abundance of reliable, easily verifiable information showing clear and obvious deceit on the part of both the 9/11 Commission and elements within government. Our problem is rather in breaking through the psychological barrier that keeps people from even wanting to look at the evidence.

As you watch "Loose Change", please remember that there is a large, well-organized network of passionate, caring people who have known about much of what is presented in this landmark documentary for years. We have accepted the disturbing reality and are ready to share with you what we know can be done to turn this all around. Below is the full article that came out in San Francisco's leading newspaper on March 29th with serious questions and great recommendations on the 9/11 cover-up. Underneath this revealing article are suggestions for what we can do now to make a difference and build a brighter future."


http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/gate/archive/2006/03/29/notes032906.DTL

Jondo wrote:That should have read "their" not "your".

So. what you're saying is that those directly involved in executing the plot (the planting of explosives, the failure to dispatch air force foghters to shoot down the hijacked aircraft) are being intimidated by another group who are threatening the well being of those directly involved and their families? So the ring of conspirators grows larger, yet they have such an incredible secrecy that no one has come forward to publicly state "I was part of the plot."

Is it not incredible that so many people involved directly in the plot and yet no one has yet to go public. Would it be possible to answer without quotes, references to links and personal insults as to my intelligence or ability to find out for myself?

no no no... all those involved in planting the explosives died in the plane that crashed in New York shortly after 911. A couple hundred people all dead... and other then the day of, hardly anyone mentions it.

Yes sorta like the shadow bit on the moon that Mythbusters proved was not possible to do on earth.

Freeman is Orwellian for Mindslave.

Freeman lose the defense and simply read what's available to you - if you're interested in the facts. The link above provides adequate meat for any person with an appetite. There are also other links on there including the indomitable Loose Change (watch Final Cut version). Feel free to comment or debate after you've taken the time to learn what exists. As for the number of people that remain silent - know that many are talking and nobody is listening. You'll see that in the link provided. I'm quite certain that this generation will be alive to see this conspiracy fully exposed. It will just take enough people to learn the facts and be vigilant in demanding answers.

2004 - 2005: A growing number of top government officials and public leaders express disbelief in the official story of 9/11. 100 prominent leaders and 40 9/11 family members sign a statement calling for an unbiased inquiry into evidence suggesting high-level government officials may have deliberately allowed the attacks to occur. [Various Publications]

Aug 9, 2006: A book by 9/11 Commission chairmen Kean and Hamilton outlines repeated deceptions by the Pentagon and FAA, including the timelines of Flights 77 and 93. CNN News: "The fact that the government would ... perpetuate the lie suggests that we need a full investigation of what is going on." [CNN, 8/9/06 , MSNBC/AP, 8/4/06, more]

2006-2009: Over 50 former senior government officials and more than 100 highly respected professors publicly criticize The 9/11 Commission Report as highly flawed, and call for a new, independent investigation. [Professors, Officials]

Sigh, more drivel. I guess its easier to drivel than try to debate.

tick wrote:Freeman is Orwellian for Mindslave.

Tick is something that just sucks blood. See I can be insulting too.

Jondo wrote:Freeman lose the defense and simply read what's available to you - if you're interested in the facts. The link above provides adequate meat for any person with an appetite. There are also other links on there including the indomitable Loose Change (watch Final Cut version). Feel free to comment or debate after you've taken the time to learn what exists. As for the number of people that remain silent - know that many are talking and nobody is listening. You'll see that in the link provided. I'm quite certain that this generation will be alive to see this conspiracy fully exposed. It will just take enough people to learn the facts and be vigilant in demanding answers.

The links provide crap. Its hard to believe that people actual believe this crap, but I guess you do?

You are tiring. Watch Loose Change Final Cut on Youtube. Until then - you don't qualify to debate anything. It's that simple.

Give it a rest already,Jondo, I don't think anyone is swallowing this bull.

Jondo still going on about this sh1t and still refusing to say anything other then.. read my links?

Hey Jondo read this... its 100% the truth you have to believe it!

http://www.gpoaccess.gov/911/


If you dont read it and believe it 100% its because you are brain washed and are simply a sheep who does not know how to think for herself.

Jondo wrote:You are tiring. Watch Loose Change Final Cut on Youtube. Until then - you don't qualify to debate anything. It's that simple.

Once again, no debate, just insults and drivel. Proves my point, yes?

There is no other way to say it Deank - you are a simpleton. If you had ANY knowledge of the facts of 9/11 - you would know that the Chairman of the 9/11 Commission Report, Thomas Kean and Vice-Chairman Hamilton have co-authoured a book about the obstruction and limitations they had placed on them by the government and that their wholly inadequate report is an embarrassment that should be burned. Not a single person on the planet stands behind that cover-up report, including the Chairmen, yet not suprisingly, Deank would employ it in his ignorant defense of something indefensible. Watch Final Cut before you attempt to look smart in the future. Try reading through this:
Here are 40 experts, including the Chairman, 9/11 Commission, Thomas H. Kean, Former Governor of New Jersey and Vice Chairman, 9/11 Commission, Lee Hamilton, Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, Homeland Security Advisory Council ~ sounding off in short quotes about their misgivings with the 9/11 commission and the far too many questions that are still UNANSWERED.

9/11 REVISITED AND QUESTIONED
.

Senator Max Cleland – Former member of the 9/11 Commission, resigned in December 2003 "I, as a member of the [9/11] Commission, cannot look any American in the eye... It is a national scandal... this White House wants to cover [9/11] up."
Senator Mark Dayton ~ Member, Senate Committee on Armed Services and Homeland Security "[NORAD] lied to the American people, they lied to Congress and they lied to your 9/11 Commission...the most gross incompetence and dereliction of responsibility and negligence"
Congressman Ron Paul - Vice Chairman of the Oversight and Investigations subcommittee "the [9/11] investigations that have been done so far as more or less cover-up and no real explanation"
Congressman Curt Weldon - "[9/11 Commission] there's something very sinister going on here... something desperately wrong... This involved what is right now the covering up of information that led to the deaths of 3,000 people"
Congresswoman Cynthia McKinney - Member of the House Armed Services Committee "the [9/11] Commission ran up against obstruction by the administration and non-cooperation from government agencies... the errors and omissions immediately jumped out at us"
Director of the FBI, Louis Freeh – "[9/11 Commission] findings--raises serious challenges to the commission's credibility and, if the facts prove out, might just render the commission historically insignificant itself"
Assistant Secretary of the U.S. Treasury, Paul Craig Roberts, PhD - "Distinguished national and international scientists and scholars present massive evidence that the 9/11 Commission Report is a hoax and that the 9/11 "terrorist attack" has been manipulated to serve a hegemonic agenda in the Middle East... We know that it is strictly impossible for any building, much less steel columned buildings, to "pancake" at free fall speed. Therefore, it is a non-controversial fact that the official explanation of the collapse of the WTC buildings is false"
Assistant Secretary of Housing, Catherine Austin Fitts - "Regarding 9/11 "The official story could not possibly have happened... It’s not possible. It’s not operationally feasible... The Commission was a whitewash. "
U.S. Army Intelligence officer, Federal Prosecutor, Office of Special Investigations, U.S. Department of Justice, John Loftus ~ "The information provided by European intelligence services prior to 9/11 was so extensive that it is no longer possible for either the CIA or FBI to assert a defence of incompetence"
Foreign Service Officer, George Kenney - " I cannot believe, much as I might like to, the standard account of 9/11"
Foreign Service Officer, J. Michael Springman - "Fifteen of the nineteen people who allegedly flew airplanes into buildings in the United States got their visas from the same CIA Consulate at Jeddah"
Deputy Attorney General, State of Pennsylvania, Philip J. Berg, Esquire - "The official story of what actually took place on 9/11 is a lie. "
Major General U.S. Army, Commanding General of U.S. Army Intelligence and Security Command, Albert Stubblebine ~ "I look at the hole in the Pentagon and I look at the size of an airplane that was supposed to have hit the Pentagon. And I said, ‘The plane does not fit in that hole’. So what did hit the Pentagon?"
Col. Ronald D. Ray, U.S. Marine Corps – Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense, Deputy Director of Field Operations for the U.S. Marine Corps Historical Center - "I'm astounded that the conspiracy theory advanced by the administration could in fact be true and the evidence does not seem to suggest that's accurate"
Col. Robert Bowman, U.S. Air Force, Director of Advanced Space Programs, PhD Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering -" the official 9/11 story is impossible .. There is a cover up .. high levels of our government don't want us to know what happened .. highly placed individuals in the administration .. Dick Cheney .. the very kindest thing we can say about George W Bush .. is high treason and conspiracy to commit murder "
Col. George Nelson, U.S. Air Force, aircraft accident investigator ~ "I never witnessed nor even heard of an aircraft loss, where the wreckage was accessible, that prevented investigators from finding enough hard evidence to positively identify the make, model, and specific registration number of the aircraft -- and in most cases the precise cause of the accident... The government alleges that four wide-body airliners crashed on the morning of September 11, 2001, resulting in the deaths of more than 3,000 human beings, yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from view .. with all the evidence readily available at the pentagon crash site, any unbiased rational investigator could only conclude that a Boeing 757 did not fly into the Pentagon as alleged. Similarly, with all the evidence available at the Pennsylvania crash site, it was most doubtful that a passenger airliner caused the obvious hole in the ground and certainly not the Boeing 757 as alleged .. the most heinous conspiracy in our country's history "

Major Douglas Rokke, PhD, U.S. Army ~ "Regarding the impact at the Pentagon on 9/11/2001 "when you look at the damage, it was obviously a missile."
Capt. Russ Wittenberg, U.S. Air Force, fighter pilot, commercial pilot flying 707, 720, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, and 777 ’s. Had previously flown Flight 93, which impacted in Pennsylvania, and Flight 175, the second plane to hit the WTC ~"The government story they handed us about 9/11 is total B.S. plain and simple...[Regarding Flight 77]"The airplane could not have flown at those speeds which they said it did without going into what they call a high speed stall. The airplane won’t go that fast if you start pulling those high G maneuvers at those bank angles... The vehicle that hit the Pentagon was not Flight 77"
Lt. Col. Karen U. Kwiatkowski, PhD, U.S. Air Force, Office of the Secretary of Defense, staff of the Director of the National Security Agency ~ "It is as a scientist that I have the most trouble with the official government conspiracy theory, mainly because it does not satisfy the rules of probability or physics. The collapses of the World Trade Center buildings clearly violate the laws of probability and physics...There was a dearth of visible debris on the relatively unmarked Pentagon, where I stood only minutes after the impact. Beyond this strange absence of airliner debris, there was no sign of the kind of damage one would expect from the impact of a large airliner... this visible evidence or lack thereof may also have been apparent to the Sec of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, who in an unfortunate slip of the tongue referred to the aircraft that slammed into the Pentagon as a ' missile ' ... I saw nothing of significance at the point of contact ~ no airplane metal or cargo debris was blowing on the lawn in front of the damaged building as smoke billowed from within the Pentagon .. all of us staring at the Pentagon that morning were indeed looking for such debris, but what we expected was not evident .. the same is true with regard to the damage we expected .. but I did not see this kind of damage. Rather, the facade had a rather small hole, no larger than 20 feet in diameter. Although this facade later collapsed, it remained standing for 30 0r 40 minutes, with the roof remaining relatively straight .. The scene, in short, was not what I would have expected from a strike by a large jetliner. It was, however, exactly what one would have expected if a missile had struck the Pentagon "

Senior Military Affairs Journalist at the Naval Postgraduate School, Barbara Honegger, MS ~ "The US military, not al Qaeda, had the sustained access weeks before 9/11 to also plant controlled demolition charges throughout the superstructures of WTC 1 and WTC 2, and in WTC 7, which brought down all three buildings on 9/11...A US military plane, not one piloted by al Qaeda, performed the highly skilled, high−speed 270−degree dive towards the Pentagon that Air Traffic Controllers on 9/11 were sure was a military plane as they watched it on their screens. Only a military aircraft, not a civilian plane flown by al Qaeda, would have given off the "Friendly" signal needed to disable the Pentagon’s anti−aircraft missile batteries as it approached the building...Only the US military, not al Qaeda, had the ability to break all of its Standard Operating Procedures to paralyze its own emergency response system"

Capt. Gregory M. Zeigler, PhD, U.S. Army, U.S. Army Intelligence Officer ~ "I knew from September 18, 2001, that the official story about 9/11 was false. ... [A]nomalies poured in rapidly: the hijackers' names appearing in none of the published flight passenger lists, BBC reports of stolen identities of the alleged hijackers or the alleged hijackers being found alive, the obvious demolitions of WTC 1 and 2...and WTC7...not hit by an airplane...the lack of identifiable Boeing 757 wreckage at the Pentagon"

Capt. Eric H. May, U.S. Army, Intelligence officer ~ "I view the 911 event ...as a matter that implies either...A) passive participation by the Bush White House through a deliberate stand-down or B) active execution of a plot by rogue elements of government, starting with the White House itself, in creating a spectacle of destruction that would lead the United States into an invasion of the Middle East"

Former Chairman, National Intelligence Estimates, CIA, responsible for preparing the President’ Daily Brief, U.S. Army Intelligence Officer, Raymond L. McGovern ~ " I think at simplest terms, there’s a cover-up. The 9/11 report is a joke...just as Hitler in 1933 cynically exploited the burning of the parliament building, the Reichstag, this is exactly what our President did in exploiting 9/11...making a war of aggression on a country that he knew had nothing to do with 9/11...that’s certainly an impeachable offense...But compelling evidence for an even more disturbing conclusion: that the 9/11 attacks were themselves orchestrated by this administration precisely so they could be thus exploited."
National Intelligence Officer and Director of the CIA's Office of Regional and Political Analysis, William Christison ~ "there is persuasive evidence that the events of September did not unfold as the Bush administration and the 9/11 Commission would have us believe. … An airliner almost certainly did not hit The Pentagon. … The North and South Towers of the World Trade Center almost certainly did not collapse and fall to earth because hijacked aircraft hit them...this all was totally an inside job… I have since decided that....at least some elements in this US government had contributed in some way or other to causing 9/11 to happen or at least allowing it to happen... The reason that the two towers in New York actually collapsed and fell all the way to the ground was controlled explosions rather than just being hit by two airplanes. … All of the characteristics of these demolitions show that they almost had to have been controlled explosions... I think you almost have to look at the 9/11 Commission Report as a joke and not a serious piece of analysis at all... It's a monstrous crime"

U.S. Marine Corps intelligence officer, case officer CIA. Robert David Steele ~ "I am forced to conclude that there is sufficient evidence to indict (not necessarily convict) Dick Cheney, Karl Rove and others...This is, without question, the most important modern reference on state-sponsored terrorism, and also the reference that most pointedly suggests that select rogue elements within the US Government, most likely led by Dick Cheney with the assistance of George Tenet, Buzzy Kronguard, and others close to the Wall Street gangs, are the most guilty of state-sponsored terrorism...I'm absolutely certain that WTC 7 was brought down by controlled demolition and that as far as I'm concerned means that this case has not been properly investigated. There's no way that building could have come down without controlled demolition"
CIA Case Officer, Specialist in the Middle East, Directorate of Operations, Awarded Career Intelligence Medal, Robert Baer ~ " Regarding the opinion there was an aspect of 'inside job' to 9/11 within the U.S. government, "There is that possibility, the evidence points at it."
Counter-terrorism expert in the Security Division of the federal Aviation Administration. Team leader of the FAA's Red ( Terrorism ) Team in the Federal Air Marshall program, Coast Guard officer, Bogdan Dzakovic ~ "At worst, I think the 9/11 Commission Report is treasonous."
Minister of Justice, West Germany, Horst Ehmke, PhD - "Terrorists could not have carried out such an operation with four hijacked planes without the support of a secret service."

State Secretary, Federal Ministry of Defense, West Germany, Andreas von Buelow, PhD - "The official story is so inadequate and far-fetched that there must be another one...This is unthinkable, without years-long support from secret apparatuses of the state and industry." President of Italy, Francesco Cossiga ~ "[9/11] could not be accomplished without infiltrations in the radar and flight security personnel."

General Leonid Ivashov, Chief of Staff, Russian armed forces, Ministry of Defense ~ "Only secret services and their current chiefs – or those retired but still having influence inside the state organizations – have the ability to plan, organize and conduct an operation [9/11] of such magnitude...Osama bin Laden and "Al Qaeda" cannot be the organizers nor the performers of the September 11 attacks. They do not have the necessary organization, resources or leaders."
Foreign Minister of Egypt, Mohamed Hassanein Heikal ~ "Bin Laden does not have the capabilities for an operation [9/11] of this magnitude. When I hear Bush talking about al-Qaida as if it was Nazi Germany or the communist party of the Soviet Union, I laugh because I know what is there. Bin Laden has been under surveillance for years: every telephone call was monitored and al-Qaida has been penetrated by American intelligence, Pakistani intelligence, Saudi intelligence, Egyptian intelligence. They could not have kept secret an operation that required such a degree of organization and sophistication."

Chief of Staff, Pakistani Army, General Mirza Aslam Beg ~ "The information which is now coming up, goes to prove that involvement by the ‘rogue elements’ of the U.S. military and intelligence organization is getting more obvious. Osama bin Laden and al-Qaeda definitely do not have the know-how and the capability to launch such operations involving such high precision coordination, based on information and expertise."
European Parliament, Committee on Security and Defense, Giulietto Chiesa ~ regarding 9-11 "Billions of people were given only one explanation....which is entirely false....everyone who dares to question it is treated as if he was a fool."
French Army Intelligence and artillery officer, Col. Pierre-Henri Bunel, Expert in the effects of artillery weapons and explosives ~ Regarding Department of Defense photos of the Pentagon on 9/11 "Image of the impact on the Pentagon is very instructive as to the nature of the explosion. ... It corresponds to a detonation of an explosive with high energetic power. The explosion does not correspond to a deflagration of kerosene...suggests a single engine flying vehicle much smaller in size than an airliner...resembles the effects of anti-concrete hollow charges that I have been able to observe on a number of battlefields...lead me therefore to think that the detonation that struck the building was that of a high-powered hollow charge used to destroy hardened buildings and carried by an aerial vehicle, a missile."
Safety Engineer and accident Analyst, National Safety Technology Authority, Finland, Heikki Kurttila, PhD ~ "Conclusion: The observed collapse time of WTC 7 was 6.5 seconds. That is only half a second longer than it would have taken for the top of the building to fall to the ground in a vacuum, and half a second shorter than the falling time of an apple when air resistance is taken into account. ... The great speed of the collapse and the low value of the resistance factor strongly suggest controlled demolition."

Counter-Terrorism Officer, MI5 (Britain), David Shayler – regarding 9-11 "The available evidence indicates that people in key positions in the FBI, the State Department, the CIA and so on were not loyal to the Constitution; that they saw an opportunity in plans laid down by genuine Islamic terrorists to carry out an operation that would shock the world and would therefore justify U.S. adventurism in the middle East, particularly in Afghanistan and Iraq."

Chairman, 9/11 Commission, Thomas H. Kean, Former Governor of New Jersey - "FAA and NORAD officials advanced an account of 9/11 that was untrue...We, to this day, don't know why NORAD told us what they told us...It was just so far from the truth."
Vice Chairman, 9/11 Commission, Lee Hamilton, Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, Homeland Security Advisory Council ~ "we got started late; we had a very short time frame...we did not have enough money...We had a lot of people strongly opposed to what we did. We had a lot of trouble getting access to documents and to people. ... So there were all kinds of reasons we thought we were set up to fail"
9/11 Commissioner, Timothy J. Roemer, PhD, Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence - "that panel members so distrusted testimony from Pentagon officials that they referred their concerns to the Pentagon's inspector general...We were extremely frustrated with the false statements we were getting"
Senior Counsel, 9/11 Commission, John J. Farmer, Jr., Former Attorney General, NJ, Former Commissioner of the State Commission of Investigations ~ Some staff members and commissioners of the Sept. 11 panel concluded that the Pentagon's initial story of how it reacted to the 2001 terrorist attacks may have been part of a deliberate effort to mislead the commission and the public "I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described...The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years"

The truth always goes through three stages as will the eventual unmasking of the 9/11 cover up ~

First ~ it is ridiculed.

Second ~ it is violently opposed.

Third ~ It is accepted as being self evident and we are daily drawing closer to stage three .

I think we should just stick to the first stage. You still have nothing that resembles fact, just a bunch of quotes from people (many with political agendas) criticizing the handling of the investigation and from this the conspiracy theorists have developed their own...well...theory. Its like 1 + 1 = whatever we want. Nice try, but still crap.

PS, if George Bush was able to pull this off without anyone going public, he's a lot smarter than anyone ever thought.

You two turkey's can only avoid the facts for so long. Freeman I gave you a little more credit than the other guy but it seems you just don't understand either. You know nothing. Gain the elementary knowledge first. I've told you how - watch Loose Change Final Cut. Frankly I could care less what you choose to believe however here's what I find curious in this argument. I just don't understand your type. I was once a believer and I ridiculed people with such conspiracy theories on 9/11. Those typical reactionists, at work, again, in even the most obvious event of terrorism. However, all of the early theories were based primarily on the visual belief that the buildings were demolished. It wasn't until later that the mountain of evidence came. And when it did, and I was told about it by an acquaintance - I would have run into a burning building to read it. That's the difference between our types - you can't even be bothered to digest the evidence.

I can't be bothered to digest bullshit. Evidence is fine, you just haven't provided any. Gobble gobble.

Good grief.

good try Jondo.
most of the peeps who post here are busy lining up for their flu shots and don't have time for reason or logic.

http://www.davidicke.com/content/view/26440

The Massachusetts Senate has
passed the flu pandemic bill S 2028 that imposes a state of fascism
whenever the governor decides to do so in the wake of a flu pandemic -
like, you know, the one they plan to engineer. The bill authorises the
state health commissioner, law enforcement, and medical personnel to:

* Vaccinate the population

* Enter private property with no warrants

* Quarantine people against their will

* Arrest without a warrant anyone a police officer deems has violated an isolation or quarantine order

* Jail or fine at the rate of $1,000 a day anyone in such violation ..

and yes deank, I know you are not in Massachusetts and are unaffected and unconcerned.