does treatment and programming actually help rehab chronic offenders or is it a waste

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/shining-a-spotlight-on-young-car-thieves.html

Its about damn time someone tried to answer that question.

Let all pretend to act shocked when the answer is "its a waste"

Not to be picky, but the social-service industry doesn't consider it a waste...but is it effective??....NOPE.
What has worked very effectively, and 100% of the time, was locking these cronicks up.

JTF wrote:...the social-service industry...

That there is the problem IMO...

I worked for one social service agnecy when I was younger. At the time Filmon made some huge cuts in funding to this particular Manitoba wide program. Cuts that basically had this one guy at the place I was working at lose his job.

The place's reaction to the cuts? Why it took me, him and 4 other paid employees and sat us down for two days making placards saying things like "cut this!" (followed by a finger).. and sent me out for three days to get signatures on a petition. They even showed me how to "certify" signatures where the person could not write and could simply mark with an X. And then it sent him and another worker down to Winnipeg to protest at the leg. paying for gas and hotel rooms and such.

The end result? The guy was laid off, I took over all of his responsibilities with no training.

Thats the whole problem with social services, it is incredibly difficult to measure success and therefore it becomes subjective rather than objective. If you try to cut a program, you are an ogre and considered to be a first cousin of Stephen Harper. Many programs are preventative, so how can you tell if you actually stopped someone from doing something socially unacceptable. Once someone has stolen a car, they are a criminal and are supposed to be dealt with by the criminal justice system (thats another story altogether), but all these warm, feel good programs are not working, otherwise we would see a reduction in car thefts. Criminal Justice also deals with deterrence. Make the punishment bad enough that someone doesn't want to chance doing something, or again. That part is not working, but warm fuzzy feelings aren't the solution either.

Usaully by them getting a job or their Grade 12 or not being arrested for something their are many ways to judge success , if you know what to look for eduacation is the biggest.

I get a kick out of reports that someone just arrested "does not have a record" as if that is meaningful. I think it just means they've never been caught before.

The notion that because someone got a job or got their diploma counts as success is nice. It would be nice to assume that but it not concrete evidence.

Some people believe treating criminals nice and giving them every break possible and releasing them early is the best way to treat them once they've been convicted. How's that working for us?

Throw the book at them. I'll measure success by counting the days they are behind bars NOT killing or raping or beating someone up. That is very easy to measure...

Solution: fast track executions. Let's clean up society.

Um wonder what Tom Sophonow might say about that approach, and yes I believe in getting tougher but I also believe in the third strike option in some cases .

Hey third strike works for me. Whatever it takes if it means the bleeding hearts just get the frick out of the way. Let's do it.

And if the occasional death penalty discourages just one person from killing an innocent victim I'm all for that as well. Just gotta ensure the right person is convicted is all.

What would it take to get the death penalty in our current system? a 15th time being caught for murder? Christ right now they dont even get life anymore.

We do not have the death penalty, haven,t for years , what we need is life is life no parole no faint hope and hard time is hard time .

Reinstate the death penalty...

With DNA being what it is today, it is possible to determine absolutely that a person is guilty.

Why not reinstitute the Death Penalty?

HAVING the Death Penalty means nothing if it's not used.

Even in places in the US where they have it...criminals sit on "death row" for YEARS. Whether it's from a system unwilling to actually use it, or a criminal (still) abusing the system with appeals & pleas...it doesn't work unless it's enforced.

I would have to say that this woman alone shows that some people just dont want to even try to be reformed.

http://www.courant.com/community/west-hartford/hc-west-harford-burglary0813.artaug13,0,6566421.story

I support new legislation to create fast-track executions. Turn the bad guys into worm food. And if they should find God before they die, help 'em to meet their maker.

I was checking the Statistics on the National Parole Board site, and can't seem to find how many parolees re-offend while on parole. I wonder where to look for the number of inmates who have been "rehabilitated" but are convicted on subsequent offences? Bet no one wants to talk about those numbers.

The recidivism rate... You can be sure it exists. And it absolutely should be public.

It is very, very rare that murderers re-offend...those crimes are usually ones of passion and/or booze.

I have a hard time simply writting off most of those people. Maybe we should just turn them into slaves for the balance of their lives.

JTF wrote:It is very, very rare that murderers re-offend...those crimes are usually ones of passion and/or booze.

I have a hard time simply writting off most of those people. Maybe we should just turn them into slaves for the balance of their lives.

That is likely true of the pissed off wife that murders her husband or the drunk roommate who murders his roommate.

I wonder how true that is of the gang-bangers that are running around shooting indiscriminately at houses and wedding halls? I wonder if that same gang-banger is also committing a whack of other crimes before and after his murder conviction. Don't forget he likely will only receive a short jail term for that gangster murder...

go on stats can.. search
recidivism

Triniman wrote:I support new legislation to create fast-track executions. Turn the bad guys into worm food. And if they should find God before they die, help 'em to meet their maker.

Reminds me of the line "you can get yourself a first-class ticket to the resurrection"

We need to listen to James Cotton and give these repeaters time at a rock quarry. They could transfer the pileefrom one end and back to the other for 10 hours a day. The point is - they will learn a work ethic. It's disgusting that we let the politicians continue "studying" the issue of crime. Listen to the damn criminals - our so-called justice system is a joke. As far as I'm concerned - every sentence should be indefinate - only determined when the convict demonstrates that they are a non-threat to the public. That could be a month - that could be 10 years. They will soon learn that taking classes in incarceration (to read and write?, which should be mandatory) will go a long way to demonstrating their sincerity (instead of lifting weights and fighting). The onus needs to be shifted to they. Until then - the joke is on us.