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the winnipeg sandbox » winnipeg sandbox.. » local... » Umm...Rapid Transit (Would it be a Winnipeg forum without this thread?)

Umm...Rapid Transit (Would it be a Winnipeg forum without this thread?)

+19
eViL tRoLl
umcrouc0
Outsider
rosencrentz
jimj_wpg
holly golightly
Freeman
JT Estoban
IG Guy
AGEsAces
EdWin
Electrician
grumpy old man
egomaniac
FlyingRat
Deank
nickelback
LivingDead
Ex-Pat-Pegger
23 posters

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Guest


Guest

Winnipeg is too spread out now to have an economical LRT system.

I know just how stupid that sounds to you GOM, but what the hell, live with it.

rosencrentz

rosencrentz
uber-contributor
uber-contributor

If you can get your mind around the following concepts!
What is the rush?
Take your time!
Relax!
Read the paper!
Read your stupid University Book!
Read your stupid University notes!
Talk to the stranger seated beside you!
If you can accept any of the above concepts, then you have just saved the city $900,000,000 to $2,000,000,000,000 dollars.

EdWin- I take offence that you think my thinking is old fashioned. I have it on good authority that all sane people living in Winnipeg are at least 50 years old, and anyone of the " younger generation" are not sane and/or are on drugs, hence a long bus ride would be found to be soothing!

http://www.elansofas.com

EdWin

EdWin
major-contributor
major-contributor

I am holding onto hope that the younger generation will prevail in planning for the LONG TERM future of Winnipeg, and that this whole anti-change mentality will be a relic of the past.

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

It does sound stooopid J2F. It says we missed our opportunity so let's not do anything to rectify it. It says frick our future generation because I'm too cheap to part with one of my nickels.

But you've ignored every question I've asked you on this subject and it seems you can't be bothered explaining your position other than snarky repartee. As usual.

Sorry to say J2F you are part of the problem.

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

You create the problem in your mind. I don't see a problem actually.

I don't want Winnipeg to become a Calgary or a Toronto. I like it to be Winnipeg. You see, I don't become embarrassed telling people where I live. I like to tell them we are a small town. We are. Get over it.
If you believe that you can make a pickle back into a cucumber, you are free to do so, but please, try it on your own dime hank you.
btw. You keep talking around the essence of the problem..our size and location.

It isn't good enough to say "never mind that" and pretend these realities don't exist..they are what drives the argument.

EdWin

EdWin
major-contributor
major-contributor

JTF wrote:You create the problem in your mind. I don't see a problem actually.

I don't want Winnipeg to become a Calgary or a Toronto. I like it to be Winnipeg. You see, I don't become embarrassed telling people where I live. I like to tell them we are a small town. We are. Get over it.
If you believe that you can make a pickle back into a cucumber, you are free to do so, but please, try it on your own dime hank you.
btw. You keep talking around the essence of the problem..our size and location.

It isn't good enough to say "never mind that" and pretend these realities don't exist..they are what drives the argument.

I'm not sure of your age, J2F, but your response here is very much typical of the older generation; the one that fears change. You have essentially stated that there. This mentality is the one that will keep youth on the go to other cities. I want Winnipeg to become like a Vancouver or Toronto or Edmonton, but still be Winnipeg. This is very much possible. Winnipeg deserves to have politicians that will help catapult it to the top. I absolutley don't like when people refer to Winnipeg as a "small town". Sorry, a place with 700,000 people is not a small town. Cities like Regina, Saskatoon, Victoria and Halifax,who are much smaller, don't refer to themselves as a small town; they are cities.

In 30-40 years, once this "I don't want change in my small Winnipeg" mentality is dead and burried, the city that I want so desperately will appear. Better later than never I guess.

Electrician

Electrician
general-contributor
general-contributor

EdWin wrote: In 30-40 years, once this "I don't want change in my small Winnipeg" mentality is dead and burried, the city that I want so desperately will appear. Better later than never I guess.
That "later" will cost millions more than it would cost today, without even mentioning all the jobs put on hold until then...

http://www.new.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1416203996

EdWin

EdWin
major-contributor
major-contributor

Electrician wrote:
EdWin wrote: In 30-40 years, once this "I don't want change in my small Winnipeg" mentality is dead and burried, the city that I want so desperately will appear. Better later than never I guess.
That "later" will cost millions more than it would cost today, without even mentioning all the jobs put on hold until then...

Precisely, all the more reason to implement an LRT now, especially during this recession when the costs will be less dramatic.

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

JTF wrote:btw. You keep talking around the essence of the problem..our size and location.
I do??? You were the first to bring size up as an issue. Ditto geography.

I don't understand your POV. You want Winnipeg to be a small city? What is a small city?

Get over it? There is that snarky debate technique. Why not at least give arguing your position an honest effort and lose these infantile comments? You're better than that j2f.

You don't agree with rapid transit. I can accept that. Hell I am probably more on your side of the fence on this issue. But please present your argument and leave the snark out of it.

AGEsAces

AGEsAces
moderator
moderator

There's a problem with the statement "I want it to stay Winnipeg"...there's no such thing as a successful stagnant ANYTHING.

If a business does not grow, it dies.
Cities are businesses...the population will grow, exponentially if it's a popular city.
If the city develops in such a way that drives people away, then it will die. If there's no draw left...people leave...the population declines.

Planning for future development and infrastructure should be at the forefront of every major city. Winnipeg is no more spread out than Philadelphia...in fact, I'd say less so...yet they offer an LRT system to cover the large expanse. And they have a similar river system running through it...only the rivers are twice as big.

The other problem with planning, is everyone keeps thinking laterally. We build our buildings UP, yet we plan to get to them on the ground.

Here's where private funding becomes such a huge part. Let's say IG wants to provide LRT access to their building downtown...they have a whack of employees, it would make sense. So they donate $10M or so to the project, and then pay to have a "station" installed at their 2nd or 3rd floor street front. Something where an elevated rail actually pulls up to their building and stops to let people on/off (of course a public access area that lets anyone get off and go down to street level...but walk straight across and go to work for those who work there).

Do the same with other major buildings in the area...and what do you think the hotels will pay to have their "stations" installed? If the system is planned properly...adding sections of rails would only be a matter of funding. We don't need 10-car subways/trains running overhead. Get single-car monorails to run around. Something that only holds 10-20 people at a time...but get dozens of them to cover the city. Heck...we could even "sell" the cars to various businesses like we're doing the buses now.

The buses could still run for street-level...or to reach the "outskirts" till demand increases...or the city expands.

http://www.photage.ca

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

grumpy old man wrote:
JTF wrote:btw. You keep talking around the essence of the problem..our size and location.
I do??? You were the first to bring size up as an issue. Ditto geography.

I don't understand your POV. You want Winnipeg to be a small city? What is a small city?

Get over it? There is that snarky debate technique. Why not at least give arguing your position an honest effort and lose these infantile comments? You're better than that j2f.

You don't agree with rapid transit. I can accept that. Hell I am probably more on your side of the fence on this issue. But please present your argument and leave the snark out of it.
Ohhh...touchy eh.

Do you actually want me to make the connection between what size and location have to do with our developement as a city?

jimj_wpg

jimj_wpg
contributor
contributor

A single monorail car, carrying 20-30 passengers at a time, would be less better than a bus.

Yes, you do have it right in other ways.... In other cities, it is the private companies along right-of-way that pay for all or part of the station cost. If there were a station at Portage and Memorial, then The Bay, and IG, and maybe the Univ. of Winnipeg could all chip in to the costs of a really great (warm) station. But I really feel that this station should be underground, then you're not limited to the length of the station by the length of the street between Memorial Blvd. and Vaughan St.

rosencrentz

rosencrentz
uber-contributor
uber-contributor

Rapid Transit is a nice idea, isn't it?
Can anyone tell me what the cost would be to cover whatever area should be covered, and then tell me what the benefits would be for how many people?

COST/BENEFIT PLEASE!!!
Rapid transit for how many people at what cost and for what benefit!

I will bet you that it makes absolutely no sense, and that is why Mayor Sam , to get what $38 million dollars from the province and the feds is willing to spend that money on 3.2 miles of track!!

http://www.elansofas.com

EdWin

EdWin
major-contributor
major-contributor

rosencrentz wrote:Rapid Transit is a nice idea, isn't it?
Can anyone tell me what the cost would be to cover whatever area should be covered, and then tell me what the benefits would be for how many people?

COST/BENEFIT PLEASE!!!
Rapid transit for how many people at what cost and for what benefit!

I will bet you that it makes absolutely no sense, and that is why Mayor Sam , to get what $38 million dollars from the province and the feds is willing to spend that money on 3.2 miles of track!!

Oh, you are right, Rozy. It makes no sense.

It makes no sense in Ottawa, Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton, Toronto, Vancouver. And it will make no sense in Saskatoon, Victoria, Spokane and Kitchener Waterloo. It makes no sense to provide citizens with viable, attractive modes of public transportation to get off the lazy fat asses and save some money on gas. It also doesn't make sense to plan for population growth in the future and curbing car dependency.

No sense whatsoever. This is what it was like talking with my great grandfather who was so stuck in the 1920s that mentioning any form of "change" he got very ornery about.

Electrician

Electrician
general-contributor
general-contributor

rosencrentz wrote:Rapid Transit is a nice idea, isn't it?
Can anyone tell me what the cost would be to cover whatever area should be covered, and then tell me what the benefits would be for how many people?

COST/BENEFIT PLEASE!!!
Rapid transit for how many people at what cost and for what benefit!

I will bet you that it makes absolutely no sense, and that is why Mayor Sam , to get what $38 million dollars from the province and the feds is willing to spend that money on 3.2 miles of track!!
If planned properly, it can be a benefit to all. If you rethink the cost, remember to add the extra revenue from construction company income tax. So some of the money actually goes back into funding the projects. The way it's being planned right now, just won't haul in the extra passengers. A BRT would cost very little, if used on the existing bus routes. You just can't spend millions, and end up with the same result as you have with the present transit system. I think all this wait and see has just stuck a heavy lead ball on the city's chain... Maybe Mayor Katz should go visit Vienna, Austria, for some good advice. Lol, even the Turks are working their way into the future. I'm living in a city that used to be known for an infamous slogan which meant "it can't be done". Now, the present mayor has shown everyone that it CAN be done. He is turning this city into a central European hub capital on all fronts, just like it should be. Get a great mayor to run the city, and you'll start to benefit from the changes immediately.

http://www.new.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1416203996

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

JTF wrote:Do you actually want me to make the connection between what size and location have to do with our developement as a city?
You are brodbeck.

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

LMAO that was good , some how I fail to see him under that sheet that went in to the wrong load of laundry.

jimj_wpg

jimj_wpg
contributor
contributor

Pavolo wrote:LMAO that was good , some how I fail to see him under that sheet that went in to the wrong load of laundry.

Transltion, please. Question

jimj_wpg

jimj_wpg
contributor
contributor

jimj_wpg wrote:
Pavolo wrote:LMAO that was good , some how I fail to see him under that sheet that went in to the wrong load of laundry.

Translation, please. Question

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

BOO!

sorry nothing to add that has not already been said a few hundred times just wanted to be in on the posting..
oh and we already have BRT, dont believe me.. take a super express to the university

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Sheet, avatar, colour , duh simple enough now .

jimj_wpg

jimj_wpg
contributor
contributor

Got it now. cheers

Well, the colour of the sheet is very Spring like robin egg blue. I don't know if there is a message in the colour though.

It is indeed "web-safe". lol!

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Sorry for the sarcasm

Electrician

Electrician
general-contributor
general-contributor

jimj_wpg wrote:Got it now. cheers

Well, the colour of the sheet is very Spring like robin egg blue. I don't know if there is a message in the colour though.

It is indeed "web-safe". lol!

I guess this had something to do with the thread's topic... Maybe the "Umm..." part.
It might be web-safe, but is it Dean-safe?
Umm...

http://www.new.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1416203996

rosencrentz

rosencrentz
uber-contributor
uber-contributor

I ask about a cost/benefit plan or study, and I get no answers.
I get some nonsense about a construction company's profit! Does that mean that the construction company is going to give its profit over to the city? Come on, make some sense!
All I want to know is what this raprd transit system is going to cost the city, and what is the benefit?
I can see lots of costs and ZERO benefits! Saving 10 minutes is not a benefit, unless the system is raising its prices to pay for the new , faster route, and knowing Winnipegers if a regular trip is $2.25 and the faster trip on a new system is $3.25, then Winnipegers will prefer the $2.25 trip!
Who will pay an extra dollar to pay for the new quicker trip?
Has anyone asked that question?
Perhaps the 43,000,000 trips taken by transit riders would generate an additional $43,000,000 ? Then we can figure out what Winnipeg can afford to spend on a new rapid transit system! That would make sense, put into that context, wouldn't it?

http://www.elansofas.com

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

I would not pay that extra dollar... but that is as good of a plan as I have heard Rosie.. write a letter to the editor... see what kind of response you get.

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