damn jewish haters doing what they can to ensure that mosque suceeds

Technically-speaking the mosque in question is two blocks away from Ground Zero.

yeah.. and technically speaking Muslims died in the attack as well so I really dont understand the hate.

You go Jews!

Yes we do.....

Anti-Semitic Semites!

The ones who oppose the new mosque - the existing building on the site is already used as a mosque - are the ones who want to hand the terrorists a victory. They're the ones who want to change America from a country with freedom of religion, to one where with a state religion and all the others second class citizens.

Should anyone disagree, then along with downtown New York as an Islam-free zone, please include a list of sites where Islamic sites should not be allowed.

It amazes me at just how much America has changed since 9/11. Paranoia runs rampant.

Remember when there was speculation about whether Obama was muslim? And a bunch of his supporters vehemently denied it - "No he's not!"... then they stopped because there's not supposed to be anything wrong with being muslim, and it seemed like they were saying it was undesirable.

They elected a black president, but no way would they elect a muslim president. Kinda proves the point of the terrorists, imo.

Christ, some are still speculatin' that he was not even born in the U.S......lots of weirdness out there and all because one group was mad at losing the last election. Boohoo. I wonder what will happen in the mid-terms....should be interesting.

Roger very poetic however that is nonsense. NYC is a melting pot. Run that referendum in NYC and they would wildly reject the notion of a mosque at that site (my speculation). This racism industry must end. Did you ever see Gangs of New York?

Miz P. Watch the Dem's be decimated.

Ah maybe but early numbers are also indicating a disenchantment with the tea baggerz too! So what will happen come November? Adjustments for sure but in whose favour? I put my faith in those who are decidedly undecided....they are biding their time and they are a large voting bloc.

darkwind wrote: Kinda proves the point of the terrorists, imo.

How so? I'm having a Dickens of a time connecting the dots.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 20 years ago or so nobody gave a rat's ass about Muslims. Then they started blowing things up. Now we have a perception a few asshat radicals created and the rest have to endure. IMO.

The problem as I see it with the "rest" is their silence or lack of will to condemn the actions of those who use the Quran to forward agendas of violence against those who they see as infidels and those within their own communities such as women and girls. The silent majority has to grow a spine and speak up.

The way they are structured becomes problematic for those results. They don't have a "Pope" type guy that speaks for all of them.

There have been lots that have spoken out. That's not the problem. The problem is the ffucken radical mofos. Those have been found in all religions I reckon.

And it is the "radical mofos" who appeal to that segment of muslim society that is the most disaffected and disillusioned, the growing youth. Look at the birth stats for many of the Islamic countries and one will see that the majority are under the age of thirty. Combine that with bad economies, layers of corruption and lack of opportunity and one has excellent recruiting ground for suicide bombers and holy warriors. Add to the mix lack of worldly education/experience and propaganda....?

Now one could ask then why did the 9/11 gang come from fairly affluent families in Saudi Arabia? Or why have we seen a rise in fervency in European and North American born young muslim males? Those are questions that deserve answers and I am afraid that we will never have a "pat" answer.

grumpy old man wrote:

darkwind wrote: Kinda proves the point of the terrorists, imo.

How so? I'm having a Dickens of a time connecting the dots.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 20 years ago or so nobody gave a rat's ass about Muslims. Then they started blowing things up. Now we have a perception a few asshat radicals created and the rest have to endure. IMO.

The terrorists get new recruits by making them angry that the West "hates" islam and has a war on against them already, etc, etc. Then we get stories of the NIMBY get those muslims away from here variety, and it just gives the terrorists more "proof" of their perspective.

I read a story about a mosque that was being blocked in a small-ish town because it was going to be near a US army base... people in the town made out like they just didn't want to sell the land for that price, but there was definitely an undercurrent of intolerance of the purpose the land was being bought for. A brief internet search turned up stories of building mosques being protested in multiple american cities.

That proves nothing.

Kind of a chicken and egg thing eh? Again, nobody gave a sh1t about Muslims until they started blowing things up. Same with veils. And all the obnoxious mid-east rules about men and women.

Now we do.

The "small" group demanding Sharia - was too many regardless of the number. And the "large" group of Muslims protesting was not large enough. Both sides have a long way to go before I'm satisfied - and that speaks for virtually everybody that I know. The public realtions issue is theirs - not mine/ours.

grumpy old man wrote:I'm gonna go out on a limb and say 20 years ago or so nobody gave a rat's ass about Muslims. Then they started blowing things up. Now we have a perception a few asshat radicals created and the rest have to endure. IMO.

It's been longer than 20 years, I'd say. More like back to 1948 when Arab countries attacked the new state of Israel. And so on, into the early 70s. In the 70s', we had the Arab countries give us the oil crisis, Iran held Americans hostage, the killing of Israel athletes at the Munich Olympics. And all the wars fought by directly and indirectly against Israel, continuing to this day.

At the very least, who can forget the oil crisis in the 70s?

Jondo wrote:The "small" group demanding Sharia - was too many regardless of the number. And the "large" group of Muslims protesting was not large enough. Both sides have a long way to go before I'm satisfied - and that speaks for virtually everybody that I know. The public realtions issue is theirs - not mine/ours.

"Regardless of number?" ANY number is too large for you?

This is Canada. We have freedom of speech, and democracy. We're not going to fight totalitarian anti-freedom laws like sharia law, by enacting our own totalitarian anti-freedom laws. You're free to propose ANY extremist law - but the more extremist it is, the less likely it is to happen.

I'm just moving back from Steinbach, where a liquor outlet was only allowed a year ago. Where the high school doesn't allow dances. Where you can't even get simple medical stuff when you badly need them, because even the drug stores can't or won't open on Sundays. All this is extremist Christians imposing their will on others.

Where's the protests and marches against this, by less extremist Christians? Even the proposed sharia law rules in Ontario would only apply to the small subset of Muslims who wanted it. It wasn't going to be forced on Christians, let alone other Muslims. And it was only considered because the Jewish community had their own government-endorsed legal tribunal system for those who wanted it.

If those numbers of protesters aren't enough for you, what do you propose? And does it apply to Christians too, with their laws applied to the rest of us?

Quickly before I hit the door to Inception. You're right about this much - this is Canada - we don't practice that kind of law in Canada - regardless of the size of the requested region or number. They came to Canada - not to a micro-brewery of the values that they or their prior generation fled.

I have never figured out how the religious people have a right to dictate any "rules" about store opening or closing that can be enforced by the law?
Many years ago in Toronto a businessman was fined for opening on the Sunday Sabbath, and he went to court and won. His Sabbath was Saturday and his store was closed on Saturday.
The religious "right" as far as I am cocerned are wrong in trying to legislate store opening hours.
Look in Winnipeg with noon to 6 PM, unless you have 3 workers. I think that is ridiculous! FoodFareat 2385 Portage Ave opens on Sunday at 10 AM with 3 workers and I can hear another bunch of workers in the back, probably cutting meat for the people.

Supply and demand have to regulate when a store can be open.

RogerStrong- are you serious when you say school dances are not allowed? That is incredible if true. What was that movie years ago where the same rule was in and the students organized a graduation dance outside of the towns limits?