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digging up dirt on the museum

+3
JT Estoban
grumpy old man
Deank
7 posters

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1digging up dirt on the museum Empty digging up dirt on the museum Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:47 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/breakingnews/digging-up-dirt-on-museum-48144282.html

""I think there's such an irony that a human rights museum is essentially treating this material so cavalierly and trying to distance themselves from it," Syms said. "I think there's an important principle here, in terms of rescuing the heritage and making it available.""

Again something I have been saying for a long time.

Seriously how can we freak out about the Fort... and then not give a damn about the museum location?

2digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:48 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

This right here says everything about the extremely poor planning that has gone into this project.

"We hope that in the future, technology will allow archeologists to do searches beneath the building."

3digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:52 am

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

I understood they did the archeology thing at that location. That said, one can argue that every location near a riverbank should go through that process.

And I doubt many care about the fort either. I like that they are saving it and turning that location into a park. I hate the process they followed.

4digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Tue Jun 16, 2009 10:04 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Actually, that is the most productive/enhanced/richest (whatever word you wish to use) archeological site in the province.

5digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Tue Jun 16, 2009 10:12 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

what is? the forks where the museum is? Or the fort location?

6digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 12:06 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Yet another example of the incompetetance of the people in charge of the CMHR. No

7digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:33 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

All of this was and has been debated by the powers to be . How many years do we give them to play in the dirt, when was the last time a arrow head made you go to see them on display . There is history every where and we destroy it all the time , we throw out more of it then we save .

Hell the CKY station was a prime example tapes of things you or I will never see again and they are gone , cause the new owner did not want to pay to preserve them, neither did the goverment .

8digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:14 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Deank wrote:what is? the forks where the museum is? Or the fort location?

The Forks location is.

I don't know the exact number but the number of artifacts per square meter is very high apparently.

As Jim says, a little effort was put into the area a while ago to show face, but nothing really significant has ever been done.

9digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:15 am

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

How much effort is enough? A year? 5 years? Who gets to decide?

10digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:18 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Excuse me???? You either do it or you don't. There's no such thing as 'how much effort'....it is or it isn't.

Once it is paved over, it is lost afterall.

11digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 9:34 am

JT Estoban

JT Estoban
major-contributor
major-contributor

it's not like anyone has never excavated beneath something before....hell they do it all the time in the old countries....so if someone wants those artifacts, or wants to conduct a dig after the monstrosity has been built, I say let them. You never know....it may weaken the structure and bring that baby crashing down! Smile


However, I do agree, the best time to do some kind of excavation or dig is to do it before piles have been pounded and giant holes have been dug.

12digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:37 am

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

JTF wrote:Excuse me???? You either do it or you don't. There's no such thing as 'how much effort'....it is or it isn't.

Once it is paved over, it is lost afterall.
My point precisely. They did bring in an archeology firm and they did take a look around. It was reported that tiny bits of artifacts were found but nothing of note.

So I ask again, is what they did enough?

13digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Wed Jun 17, 2009 10:39 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

Their time and the scope of their investigation was actually cut back from what was originally planned.

14digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:11 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

I believe that they just scraped the surface back then. (sorry, couldn't resist.)

Didn't they find Reil's baby pictures?

15digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 6:52 pm

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

ARCHEOLOGISTS have been digging in the historic ground at The Forks since 1987, when the land was assembled for what has become the province’s most popular tourist site. In that time, they have uncovered hundreds of thousands of artifacts, such as arrowheads, shards of pottery, the remain of animals cooked at the site, evidence of campfires and one human footprint that was dated at 800 years old. There is no evidence of permanent or long-term habitation and no evidence of burial sites.

Despite all this work and more still to come, however, a few archeologists are complaining that the search for more pottery shards, fish bones and burnt wood at the site of the Canadian Museum for Human Rights, where 380,000 objects have been recovered, should continue until it gives up much more of its historical treasures. They also say the museum should be ashamed of itself for bypassing an opportunity to develop a complete picture of aboriginal life at the confluence of the Red and Assiniboine rivers, a meeting ground for some 8,000 years.

The criticism is grossly unfair and even uninformed. As most archeology students could have explained, a sample from an historical excavation is usually adequate to provide the information needed to develop an understanding of what life was like in the past. Excessive excavation, in fact, is usually discouraged because it can destroy or taint the resource, foreclosing on opportunities that might emerge with the development of new technology and investigative techniques. By essentially capping the site for 100 or 200 years or however long the building stands, the museum is preserving it in a pristine condition for the scientists of the future. There is also a rich vein of historical artifacts beneath the gravel parking lot now used by Canwest Global Park, so there is ample opportunity for more research.

The museum's staff and its builders have relied on the province's heritage experts and aboriginal elders to tell them how to proceed in a respectful manner, and their record has been exemplary in respecting First Nations heritage.

The critics say the province's legislation is weak at protecting heritage resources, even though it compares favourably with other jurisdictions across Canada.

The federal museum deserves better treatment than the dirt that has been heaped upon it. It has obeyed every government edict and spent more than $500,000 digging up ancient objects, some of which are undergoing carbon dating and residue analysis. It has even altered its design to avoid digging into the multiple layers of cultural history.

In short, it will make history without destroying it.

Winnipeg Free Press Editorial

16digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:04 pm

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

"
Winnipeg Free Press Editorial"

17digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:35 pm

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

Exactly. It seems on this subject opinion is all that is needed to debate the subject.

18digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 10:56 pm

death128

death128
contributor
contributor

I walked by the Human Right Museum site today. I had a good laugh when I realized that ALL of the workers were white middle-aged males.

19digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:15 pm

grumpy old man

grumpy old man
administrator
administrator

Ummm, really? You saw ALL of the workers? And this caused you to laugh? Why? You not been paying attention?

Youth today does not want to take blue collar labour type jobs. So I guess older workers do the work. And this is funny?

Aboriginals don't seem to be breaking down contractor's doors. So I guess white workers do the work. And this is funny?

Women don't seem to be flocking to get into the labour trades. So I guess male workers do the work. And this is funny?

You have a weird sense of humour.

Good thing those middle-aged white men do that work else nothing would get done. And that is decidedly NOT funny.

Footnote: in your observation did you notice the full time shaman at the site?

20digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Fri Jun 19, 2009 7:33 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

Really who cares who doe,s it as long as it gets done , Full time Shaman will have to see.

21digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:34 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest


By essentially capping the site for 100 or 200 years or however long the building stands, the museum is preserving it in a pristine condition for the scientists of the future.

Soooo....paving over and building on the site is actually preserving it eh????

That statement about sums up the essence of the museum. Bullshit baffles brains!!!

22digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:40 am

Deank

Deank
contributor eminence
contributor eminence

"Soooo....paving over and building on the site is actually preserving it eh????"

The people who took over the site of the old fort a hundred years ago thought so to!

Smile

23digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:09 pm

Electrician

Electrician
general-contributor
general-contributor

Remember. This area used to be Lake Agassiz...
They won't find any older human artifacts under that ground, maybe some seashells. You'd have to search in higher ground for older stuff, although, there could always be the possibility of hitting an oil well...
study

http://www.new.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1416203996

24digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:40 pm

Triniman

Triniman
general-contributor
general-contributor

Doer knows the NDP won't be re-elected if they break the camel's back by giving away millions more to make the museum a reality. It's bad enough that they screwed us with ticketgate. The public will have their revenge big time at the polls. Heh, heh! No tax-payer funded sweet retirement job for Doer as the pres of the rights museum. Deny the EvilDoer.

25digging up dirt on the museum Empty Re: digging up dirt on the museum Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:24 am

Guest

Anonymous
Guest

They just appointed a dude from CanWest to the Board...surprise ! surprise !

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/local/two-appointed-to-rights-museum-board-48672967.html

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